SAP-WUG Digest, Vol 67, Issue 25
Guru Dutt
gurudutt.sap at gmail.com
Wed Jun 9 12:06:57 EDT 2010
Thanks Mike, your input came very valuable for me.
Cheers,
Guru
On Wed, Jun 9, 2010 at 6:42 PM, <sap-wug-request at mit.edu> wrote:
> Send SAP-WUG mailing list submissions to
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>
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> or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
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>
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>
> When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
> than "Re: Contents of SAP-WUG digest..."
>
>
> Today's Topics:
>
> 1. Re: Correlation in workflow (Mike Pokraka)
> 2. Portal UWL problems (Oleg Mayorov)
>
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Message: 1
> Date: Wed, 9 Jun 2010 10:36:24 +0100 (BST)
> From: "Mike Pokraka" <wug at workflowconnections.com>
> Subject: Re: Correlation in workflow
> To: "SAP Workflow Users' Group" <sap-wug at MIT.EDU>
> Message-ID:
> <08b5c8d2c49899d2fbca46a3d157c7e4.squirrel at g.mail.aaisp.net.uk>
> Content-Type: text/plain;charset=iso-8859-1
>
> Hi Guru,
>
> Though any real-world input would be useful, I would not rely too much on
> any answers you receive, because a) correlations in volume scenarios would
> be mostly within PI, and b) there are too many variables to make a valid
> comparison with another system. How many of the processes will generate a
> correlation step? How long will correlations stay open? What are the
> volumes of correlated events (whether matching or not)?
>
> I think your two biggest factors are the average number of open or waiting
> correlations at any point in time and the number of events of that type.
> However since it'a a common scenario in PI which is designed for volume
> processing, I suspect your performance impact would not be significant.
> However I would recommend settin up a few test scenarios based on your
> process to determine how it scales up.
>
> Cheers,
> Mike
>
>
> On Tue, June 8, 2010 5:34 pm, Guru Dutt wrote:
> > Hi All,
> >
> > I have tested the correlation via wait events of Workflow in SAP. But I
> > need
> > to know the performance side of correlation and how does it internally
> > work.
> >
> >
> > The workflow I am implementing is of high volume(10,000 per week). My
> only
> > question is by implementing correlation will affect performance of the
> > system.
> >
> > Please let know your answers & suggestions so that I can give a quite a
> > deep
> > thinking before implementing the same in this scenario without adverse
> > effect.
> >
> > Thanks in advance.
> >
> > Best regards,
> > Guru Dutt
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > On Tue, Jun 8, 2010 at 9:36 PM, <sap-wug-request at mit.edu> wrote:
> >
> >> Send SAP-WUG mailing list submissions to
> >> sap-wug at mit.edu
> >>
> >> To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
> >> http://mailman.mit.edu/mailman/listinfo/sap-wug
> >> or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
> >> sap-wug-request at mit.edu
> >>
> >> You can reach the person managing the list at
> >> sap-wug-owner at mit.edu
> >>
> >> When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
> >> than "Re: Contents of SAP-WUG digest..."
> >>
> >>
> >> Today's Topics:
> >>
> >> 1. Re: BPM approvals (Sandy)
> >>
> >>
> >> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
> >>
> >> Message: 1
> >> Date: Tue, 8 Jun 2010 10:26:18 +1000
> >> From: Sandy <maorriyan.santoso at gmail.com>
> >> Subject: Re: BPM approvals
> >> To: "SAP Workflow Users' Group" <sap-wug at mit.edu>
> >> Message-ID:
> >> <AANLkTikl3ZbiWjFU-K_qcVO7PMl4HZGD_Y4obwLzgai3 at mail.gmail.com>
> >> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1252"
> >>
> >> Hi Jocelyn.
> >> Hopefully this thread is not outdated yet.
> >>
> >> 1. Does this mean BRM is the only solution to determine work item
> >> recipient?
> >> Does this mean agent determination in BPM has less flexibility and less
> >> SAP
> >> template on determining agent i.e. SAP Workflow has built in to
> >> determine
> >> initiator's manager?
> >>
> >> 2. If BRM is the only option to determine agent, does BRM can be used in
> >> escalation management where factory calendar need to be take into
> >> account?
> >>
> >> 3. If there is no direct connection with organisation structure/
> >> enterprise
> >> structure, does this mean BPM can not utilise HR evaluation path?
> >>
> >> 4. Can you elaborate forwarding/ substitution a little harder for
> >> long-running scenarios?
> >>
> >> 5. Does BPM has configuration such Task Profile where we can put some
> >> restriction on forward and and substitution process?
> >>
> >> My mindset still full with SAP Workflow concept, still trying to
> >> understand
> >> what we can sell on BPM
> >>
> >> Cheers.
> >>
> >> On Tue, May 11, 2010 at 10:02 AM, Dart, Jocelyn <jocelyn.dart at sap.com
> >> >wrote:
> >>
> >> > Hi Karl,
> >> >
> >> > At the moment these are the major approaches for agent assignment in
> >> BPM:
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > a) Use UME/Portal user groups/roles/user ids directly (actually
> >> > groups are really useful for identifying teams of people)
> >> >
> >> > b) Calculate the agents using a BRM rule (e.g. using a decision
> >> > table) and return as a (list of ) UME/Portal user group/role/user
> >> id(s)
> >> >
> >> > c) Call a web service to calculate the agents and return as a
> >> (list
> >> > of) UME/Portal user group/role/user id(s)
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > There are mapping functions pre-provided to e.g. convert a regular
> >> unique
> >> > user id to a UME/Portal user id equivalent.
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > There?s no direction connection to the backend org chart? not a big
> >> deal
> >> > for finding the original agents, but means you need to think about
> >> > forwarding/substitution a little harder for long-running scenarios.
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > Hope that helps.
> >> >
> >> > Regards,
> >> >
> >> > Jocelyn
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > *From:* sap-wug-bounces at mit.edu [mailto:sap-wug-bounces at mit.edu] *On
> >> > Behalf Of *Karl Nietz
> >> > *Sent:* Friday, 7 May 2010 4:49 PM
> >> >
> >> > *To:* sap-wug at mit.edu
> >> > *Subject:* BPM approvals
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > Hi,
> >> >
> >> > Further to Jocelyn's response below, is there any documentation or a
> >> blog
> >> > that explains how BPM actually supplants workflow for simple
> >> processess
> >> such
> >> > as PO approval, as indicated? I've checked the ES simple sample
> >> > applications and the purchase requisition approval example seems to
> >> gloss
> >> > over the issue, or at least appears to be using an underlying workflow
> >> > template for steps such as agent assignment. Or is this the whole
> >> thrust
> >> of
> >> > the BPM/workflow relationship? A chap called Kenichi has a 1hour
> >> podcast
> >> on
> >> > SDN but the screens are unreadable. Anything to get me started would
> >> be
> >> > helpful.
> >> >
> >> > Karl
> >> >
> >> > ----- Forwarded by Karl Nietz/AUS/CSC on 06/05/2010 01:49 PM -----
> >> >
> >> > From:
> >> >
> >> > "Dart, Jocelyn" <jocelyn.dart at sap.com>
> >> >
> >> > To:
> >> >
> >> > "SAP Workflow Users' Group" <sap-wug at mit.edu>
> >> >
> >> > Date:
> >> >
> >> > 06/05/2010 01:18 PM
> >> >
> >> > Subject:
> >> >
> >> > RE: This Group
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > ------------------------------
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > Hi Mike,
> >> > Just adding the SAP employee perspective... and by the way I'm Product
> >> Lead
> >> > for NW BPM in ANZ Field Services this year.
> >> >
> >> > I agree currently NW BPM and Workflow should be considered as
> >> > complementary. Mainly due to existing business content and solution
> >> > maturity issues. Also yes Workflow will not be going away anytime
> >> soon.
> >> > It is however possible to use NW BPM instead of Workflow for a new
> >> site
> >> > that does not use workflow at all for scenarios that we would
> >> previously
> >> > have done in workflow (e.g. purchase order approval) - provided
> >> current
> >> > limitations/restrictions are understood and this is happening at some
> >> sites.
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > A lot of the concepts and issues around process handling are the same.
> >> > We currently have a BPM forum in SDN, so the question for this forum
> >> is:
> >> as
> >> > BPM usage grows do you want to start covering that area as well or
> >> just
> >> > stick with traditional workflow?
> >> >
> >> > I can't give any official details on future releases yet but I can
> >> confirm
> >> > generally that we are expecting some better integration options
> >> between
> >> > workflow and NW BPM when we get to 7.3 on both the backend and NW BPM
> >> > platforms most likely around business event management and calling of
> >> > ABAP-based applications. We also expect some sort of import for 7.3
> >> > although I don't expect we will be translating from workflow to BPM or
> >> vice
> >> > versa - more likely import of a model from business process modelling
> >> > applications. I don't expect workflow to be further developed -
> >> although
> >> I
> >> > agree BPMN is easier to work with and enables better cross
> >> communication
> >> > between business and IT.
> >> >
> >> > If anyone has any specific questions I'm happy to provide what
> >> information
> >> > I can. There are trial versions available on SDN if you want to have
> >> a
> >> play
> >> > with NW BPM, or try out the pre-built Simple Sample Applications on
> >> the
> >> > ESWorkplace site.
> >> >
> >> > Regards,
> >> > Jocelyn
> >> >
> >> > _______________________________________________
> >> > SAP-WUG mailing list
> >> > SAP-WUG at mit.edu
> >> > http://mailman.mit.edu/mailman/listinfo/sap-wug
> >> >
> >> >
> >> -------------- next part --------------
> >> An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
> >> URL:
> >>
> http://mailman.mit.edu/pipermail/sap-wug/attachments/20100608/591d4c3f/attachment-0001.htm
> >>
> >> ------------------------------
> >>
> >> _______________________________________________
> >> SAP-WUG mailing list
> >> SAP-WUG at mit.edu
> >> http://mailman.mit.edu/mailman/listinfo/sap-wug
> >>
> >>
> >> End of SAP-WUG Digest, Vol 67, Issue 23
> >> ***************************************
> >>
> >
> >
> >
> > --
> > Regards,
> > Guru Dutt
> > Tel : +919748445814
> > Email : gurudutt.sap at gmail.com
> > _______________________________________________
> > SAP-WUG mailing list
> > SAP-WUG at mit.edu
> > http://mailman.mit.edu/mailman/listinfo/sap-wug
> >
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 2
> Date: Wed, 9 Jun 2010 17:12:37 +0400
> From: Oleg Mayorov <oleg.mayorov at gmail.com>
> Subject: Portal UWL problems
> To: sap-wug at mit.edu
> Message-ID:
> <AANLkTilNwPd37XUHEuBN06jDREzDSvCYwMet0Ln8oErZ at mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
>
> Hi all,
>
> I have some problems with my workflow scenario in UWL.
> I have a dilog step ( user decision type), wich i need to display in UWL. I
> configured xml file,
> and everithing ok, the step is visible in uwl, and i launch my webdynpro
> application when select task.
>
> 1)When i launch WDapplication, it's opening in new window ( or new browser
> tab), then i approve or reject workitem
> from WDapplication, and close tab or window, but completed task still in
> UWL, and if somebody try to complete it again, the error occurs (and it's
> normally).
> My question is - can i refresh uwl programmatically from WDynpro, when i
> approve or reject task inside of it?
>
> 2) In xml i configured CustomAttribute for item type, i get it from WF
> container:
> <CustomAttributes>
> <CustomAttributeSource id="WEBFLOW_CONTAINER"
> objectIdHolder="externalId" objectType="WebflowContainer"
> cacheValidity="session">
> <Attribute name="ORGUNIT_TEXT" type="string"
> displayName="ORGUNIT_TEXT"/>
> </CustomAttributeSource>
> </CustomAttributes>
> Then I declare my own view in xml, and add this attribute there:
>
> <DisplayAttributes>
> <DisplayAttribute name="ORGUNIT_TEXT" type="string" width=""
> sortable="yes"
> format="default" hAlign="CENTER" vAlign="TOP" maxTextWidth="0"
> headerVisible="yes">
> <Descriptions default="">
> <ShortDescriptions>
> <Description Language="en" Description="From"/>
> <Description Language="ru"
> Description="Заказчик"/>
> </ShortDescriptions>
>
> then i set this sub-view is default for uwl iview. its working, but when
> i
> receive this task, the
> custom attribute in UWL is empty, and it fills only when i refresh
> tasklist.
> is it normal, or i have miss something?
>
> Thanks in advance!
>
>
> Regards,
> Mayorov Oleg.
>
> 2010/6/9 <sap-wug-request at mit.edu>:
> > Send SAP-WUG mailing list submissions to
> > sap-wug at mit.edu
> >
> > To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
> > http://mailman.mit.edu/mailman/listinfo/sap-wug
> > or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
> > sap-wug-request at mit.edu
> >
> > You can reach the person managing the list at
> > sap-wug-owner at mit.edu
> >
> > When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
> > than "Re: Contents of SAP-WUG digest..."
> >
> >
> > Today's Topics:
> >
> > 1. Correlation in workflow (Guru Dutt)
> > 2. RE: BPM approvals (Dart, Jocelyn)
> >
> >
> > ----------------------------------------------------------------------
> >
> > Message: 1
> > Date: Tue, 8 Jun 2010 22:04:46 +0530
> > From: Guru Dutt <gurudutt.sap at gmail.com>
> > Subject: Correlation in workflow
> > To: sap-wug at mit.edu
> > Message-ID:
> > <AANLkTinMBB2no1lYwQ8Er0Ve4TV-CvXXYgVRnioGTE22 at mail.gmail.com>
> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
> >
> > Hi All,
> >
> > I have tested the correlation via wait events of Workflow in SAP. But I
> need
> > to know the performance side of correlation and how does it internally
> work.
> >
> >
> > The workflow I am implementing is of high volume(10,000 per week). My
> only
> > question is by implementing correlation will affect performance of the
> > system.
> >
> > Please let know your answers & suggestions so that I can give a quite a
> deep
> > thinking before implementing the same in this scenario without adverse
> > effect.
> >
> > Thanks in advance.
> >
> > Best regards,
> > Guru Dutt
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > On Tue, Jun 8, 2010 at 9:36 PM, <sap-wug-request at mit.edu> wrote:
> >
> >> Send SAP-WUG mailing list submissions to
> >> sap-wug at mit.edu
> >>
> >> To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
> >> http://mailman.mit.edu/mailman/listinfo/sap-wug
> >> or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
> >> sap-wug-request at mit.edu
> >>
> >> You can reach the person managing the list at
> >> sap-wug-owner at mit.edu
> >>
> >> When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
> >> than "Re: Contents of SAP-WUG digest..."
> >>
> >>
> >> Today's Topics:
> >>
> >> 1. Re: BPM approvals (Sandy)
> >>
> >>
> >> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
> >>
> >> Message: 1
> >> Date: Tue, 8 Jun 2010 10:26:18 +1000
> >> From: Sandy <maorriyan.santoso at gmail.com>
> >> Subject: Re: BPM approvals
> >> To: "SAP Workflow Users' Group" <sap-wug at mit.edu>
> >> Message-ID:
> >> <AANLkTikl3ZbiWjFU-K_qcVO7PMl4HZGD_Y4obwLzgai3 at mail.gmail.com>
> >> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="windows-1252"
> >>
> >> Hi Jocelyn.
> >> Hopefully this thread is not outdated yet.
> >>
> >> 1. Does this mean BRM is the only solution to determine work item
> >> recipient?
> >> Does this mean agent determination in BPM has less flexibility and less
> SAP
> >> template on determining agent i.e. SAP Workflow has built in to
> determine
> >> initiator's manager?
> >>
> >> 2. If BRM is the only option to determine agent, does BRM can be used in
> >> escalation management where factory calendar need to be take into
> account?
> >>
> >> 3. If there is no direct connection with organisation structure/
> enterprise
> >> structure, does this mean BPM can not utilise HR evaluation path?
> >>
> >> 4. Can you elaborate forwarding/ substitution a little harder for
> >> long-running scenarios?
> >>
> >> 5. Does BPM has configuration such Task Profile where we can put some
> >> restriction on forward and and substitution process?
> >>
> >> My mindset still full with SAP Workflow concept, still trying to
> understand
> >> what we can sell on BPM
> >>
> >> Cheers.
> >>
> >> On Tue, May 11, 2010 at 10:02 AM, Dart, Jocelyn <jocelyn.dart at sap.com
> >> >wrote:
> >>
> >> > Hi Karl,
> >> >
> >> > At the moment these are the major approaches for agent assignment in
> BPM:
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > a) Use UME/Portal user groups/roles/user ids directly (actually
> >> > groups are really useful for identifying teams of people)
> >> >
> >> > b) Calculate the agents using a BRM rule (e.g. using a decision
> >> > table) and return as a (list of ) UME/Portal user group/role/user
> id(s)
> >> >
> >> > c) Call a web service to calculate the agents and return as a
> (list
> >> > of) UME/Portal user group/role/user id(s)
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > There are mapping functions pre-provided to e.g. convert a regular
> unique
> >> > user id to a UME/Portal user id equivalent.
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > There?s no direction connection to the backend org chart? not a big
> deal
> >> > for finding the original agents, but means you need to think about
> >> > forwarding/substitution a little harder for long-running scenarios.
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > Hope that helps.
> >> >
> >> > Regards,
> >> >
> >> > Jocelyn
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > *From:* sap-wug-bounces at mit.edu [mailto:sap-wug-bounces at mit.edu] *On
> >> > Behalf Of *Karl Nietz
> >> > *Sent:* Friday, 7 May 2010 4:49 PM
> >> >
> >> > *To:* sap-wug at mit.edu
> >> > *Subject:* BPM approvals
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > Hi,
> >> >
> >> > Further to Jocelyn's response below, is there any documentation or a
> blog
> >> > that explains how BPM actually supplants workflow for simple
> processess
> >> such
> >> > as PO approval, as indicated? I've checked the ES simple sample
> >> > applications and the purchase requisition approval example seems to
> gloss
> >> > over the issue, or at least appears to be using an underlying workflow
> >> > template for steps such as agent assignment. Or is this the whole
> thrust
> >> of
> >> > the BPM/workflow relationship? A chap called Kenichi has a 1hour
> podcast
> >> on
> >> > SDN but the screens are unreadable. Anything to get me started would
> be
> >> > helpful.
> >> >
> >> > Karl
> >> >
> >> > ----- Forwarded by Karl Nietz/AUS/CSC on 06/05/2010 01:49 PM -----
> >> >
> >> > From:
> >> >
> >> > "Dart, Jocelyn" <jocelyn.dart at sap.com>
> >> >
> >> > To:
> >> >
> >> > "SAP Workflow Users' Group" <sap-wug at mit.edu>
> >> >
> >> > Date:
> >> >
> >> > 06/05/2010 01:18 PM
> >> >
> >> > Subject:
> >> >
> >> > RE: This Group
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > ------------------------------
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > Hi Mike,
> >> > Just adding the SAP employee perspective... and by the way I'm Product
> >> Lead
> >> > for NW BPM in ANZ Field Services this year.
> >> >
> >> > I agree currently NW BPM and Workflow should be considered as
> >> > complementary. Mainly due to existing business content and solution
> >> > maturity issues. Also yes Workflow will not be going away anytime
> soon.
> >> > It is however possible to use NW BPM instead of Workflow for a new
> site
> >> > that does not use workflow at all for scenarios that we would
> previously
> >> > have done in workflow (e.g. purchase order approval) - provided
> current
> >> > limitations/restrictions are understood and this is happening at some
> >> sites.
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > A lot of the concepts and issues around process handling are the same.
> >> > We currently have a BPM forum in SDN, so the question for this forum
> is:
> >> as
> >> > BPM usage grows do you want to start covering that area as well or
> just
> >> > stick with traditional workflow?
> >> >
> >> > I can't give any official details on future releases yet but I can
> >> confirm
> >> > generally that we are expecting some better integration options
> between
> >> > workflow and NW BPM when we get to 7.3 on both the backend and NW BPM
> >> > platforms most likely around business event management and calling of
> >> > ABAP-based applications. We also expect some sort of import for 7.3
> >> > although I don't expect we will be translating from workflow to BPM or
> >> vice
> >> > versa - more likely import of a model from business process modelling
> >> > applications. I don't expect workflow to be further developed -
> although
> >> I
> >> > agree BPMN is easier to work with and enables better cross
> communication
> >> > between business and IT.
> >> >
> >> > If anyone has any specific questions I'm happy to provide what
> >> information
> >> > I can. There are trial versions available on SDN if you want to have
> a
> >> play
> >> > with NW BPM, or try out the pre-built Simple Sample Applications on
> the
> >> > ESWorkplace site.
> >> >
> >> > Regards,
> >> > Jocelyn
> >> >
> >> > _______________________________________________
> >> > SAP-WUG mailing list
> >> > SAP-WUG at mit.edu
> >> > http://mailman.mit.edu/mailman/listinfo/sap-wug
> >> >
> >> >
> >> -------------- next part --------------
> >> An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
> >> URL:
> >>
>
> http://mailman.mit.edu/pipermail/sap-wug/attachments/20100608/591d4c3f/attachment-0001.htm
> >>
> >> ------------------------------
> >>
> >> _______________________________________________
> >> SAP-WUG mailing list
> >> SAP-WUG at mit.edu
> >> http://mailman.mit.edu/mailman/listinfo/sap-wug
> >>
> >>
> >> End of SAP-WUG Digest, Vol 67, Issue 23
> >> ***************************************
> >>
> >
> >
> >
> > --
> > Regards,
> > Guru Dutt
> > Tel : +919748445814
> > Email : gurudutt.sap at gmail.com
> > -------------- next part --------------
> > An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
> > URL:
>
> http://mailman.mit.edu/pipermail/sap-wug/attachments/20100608/343e8edf/attachment-0001.htm
> >
> > ------------------------------
> >
> > Message: 2
> > Date: Wed, 9 Jun 2010 01:41:16 +0200
> > From: "Dart, Jocelyn" <jocelyn.dart at sap.com>
> > Subject: RE: BPM approvals
> > To: "SAP Workflow Users' Group" <sap-wug at mit.edu>
> > Message-ID:
> >
> <8C507B5E0BA5114E933C3C6E2E9729E00665C9B9DE at DEWDFECCR01.wdf.sap.corp>
> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
> >
> > Hi Sandy,
> >
> >
> > 1. No there are 3 options as I listed below. A web service or
> Enterprise Service (delivered or custom) is the most powerful particularly
> if you need to access the organizational structure sitting in a backend
> system.
> >
> > 2. Again the factory calendar sits in the backend system so this
> would need an Enterprise Service. Or if you just want to knock out
> weekends
> there are Java utilities that can help with that that could be called use
> BRM or using an EJB module.
> >
> > 3. Use an enterprise service.
> >
> > 4. Not sure what you are looking for here. Forwarding is called
> "Delegate" in BPM and there is a button for this in the task header when
> you
> launch a BPM task.
> >
> > 5. Task Profile was never a very effective concept in SAP Business
> Workflow as it tends to be counter productive as soon as you want to create
> substitutes for combinations of tasks.
> >
> >
> > Regards,
> > Jocelyn
> >
> > From: sap-wug-bounces at mit.edu [mailto:sap-wug-bounces at mit.edu] On Behalf
> Of Sandy
> > Sent: Tuesday, 8 June 2010 10:26 AM
> > To: SAP Workflow Users' Group
> > Subject: Re: BPM approvals
> >
> > Hi Jocelyn.
> > Hopefully this thread is not outdated yet.
> >
> > 1. Does this mean BRM is the only solution to determine work item
> recipient? Does this mean agent determination in BPM has less flexibility
> and less SAP template on determining agent i.e. SAP Workflow has built in
> to
> determine initiator's manager?
> >
> > 2. If BRM is the only option to determine agent, does BRM can be used in
> escalation management where factory calendar need to be take into account?
> >
> > 3. If there is no direct connection with organisation structure/
> enterprise structure, does this mean BPM can not utilise HR evaluation
> path?
> >
> > 4. Can you elaborate forwarding/ substitution a little harder for
> long-running scenarios?
> >
> > 5. Does BPM has configuration such Task Profile where we can put some
> restriction on forward and and substitution process?
> >
> > My mindset still full with SAP Workflow concept, still trying to
> understand what we can sell on BPM
> >
> > Cheers.
> > On Tue, May 11, 2010 at 10:02 AM, Dart, Jocelyn <jocelyn.dart at sap.com
> <mailto:jocelyn.dart at sap.com>> wrote:
> > Hi Karl,
> > At the moment these are the major approaches for agent assignment in BPM:
> >
> >
> > a) Use UME/Portal user groups/roles/user ids directly (actually
> groups are really useful for identifying teams of people)
> >
> > b) Calculate the agents using a BRM rule (e.g. using a decision
> table) and return as a (list of ) UME/Portal user group/role/user id(s)
> >
> > c) Call a web service to calculate the agents and return as a (list
> of) UME/Portal user group/role/user id(s)
> >
> >
> > There are mapping functions pre-provided to e.g. convert a regular unique
> user id to a UME/Portal user id equivalent.
> >
> > There's no direction connection to the backend org chart... not a big
> deal
> for finding the original agents, but means you need to think about
> forwarding/substitution a little harder for long-running scenarios.
> >
> > Hope that helps.
> > Regards,
> > Jocelyn
> >
> > From: sap-wug-bounces at mit.edu<mailto:sap-wug-bounces at mit.edu> [mailto:
> sap-wug-bounces at mit.edu<mailto:sap-wug-bounces at mit.edu>] On Behalf Of Karl
> Nietz
> > Sent: Friday, 7 May 2010 4:49 PM
> >
> > To: sap-wug at mit.edu<mailto:sap-wug at mit.edu>
> > Subject: BPM approvals
> >
> >
> > Hi,
> >
> > Further to Jocelyn's response below, is there any documentation or a blog
> that explains how BPM actually supplants workflow for simple processess
> such
> as PO approval, as indicated? I've checked the ES simple sample
> applications and the purchase requisition approval example seems to gloss
> over the issue, or at least appears to be using an underlying workflow
> template for steps such as agent assignment. Or is this the whole thrust
> of
> the BPM/workflow relationship? A chap called Kenichi has a 1hour podcast
> on
> SDN but the screens are unreadable. Anything to get me started would be
> helpful.
> >
> > Karl
> >
> > ----- Forwarded by Karl Nietz/AUS/CSC on 06/05/2010 01:49 PM -----
> > From:
> >
> > "Dart, Jocelyn" <jocelyn.dart at sap.com<mailto:jocelyn.dart at sap.com>>
> >
> > To:
> >
> > "SAP Workflow Users' Group" <sap-wug at mit.edu<mailto:sap-wug at mit.edu>>
> >
> > Date:
> >
> > 06/05/2010 01:18 PM
> >
> > Subject:
> >
> > RE: This Group
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > ________________________________
> >
> >
> >
> > Hi Mike,
> > Just adding the SAP employee perspective... and by the way I'm Product
> Lead for NW BPM in ANZ Field Services this year.
> >
> > I agree currently NW BPM and Workflow should be considered as
> complementary. Mainly due to existing business content and solution
> maturity issues. Also yes Workflow will not be going away anytime soon.
> > It is however possible to use NW BPM instead of Workflow for a new site
> that does not use workflow at all for scenarios that we would previously
> have done in workflow (e.g. purchase order approval) - provided current
> limitations/restrictions are understood and this is happening at some
> sites.
> >
> > A lot of the concepts and issues around process handling are the same.
> > We currently have a BPM forum in SDN, so the question for this forum is:
> as BPM usage grows do you want to start covering that area as well or just
> stick with traditional workflow?
> >
> > I can't give any official details on future releases yet but I can
> confirm
> generally that we are expecting some better integration options between
> workflow and NW BPM when we get to 7.3 on both the backend and NW BPM
> platforms most likely around business event management and calling of
> ABAP-based applications. We also expect some sort of import for 7.3
> although I don't expect we will be translating from workflow to BPM or vice
> versa - more likely import of a model from business process modelling
> applications. I don't expect workflow to be further developed - although I
> agree BPMN is easier to work with and enables better cross communication
> between business and IT.
> >
> > If anyone has any specific questions I'm happy to provide what
> information
> I can. There are trial versions available on SDN if you want to have a
> play
> with NW BPM, or try out the pre-built Simple Sample Applications on the
> ESWorkplace site.
> >
> > Regards,
> > Jocelyn
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > SAP-WUG mailing list
> > SAP-WUG at mit.edu<mailto:SAP-WUG at mit.edu>
> > http://mailman.mit.edu/mailman/listinfo/sap-wug
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--
Regards,
Guru Dutt
Tel : +919748445814
Email : gurudutt.sap at gmail.com
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