[Tango-L] Now that I?m here in BsAs

[Christian Lüthen]

Thanks, Tom,

I knew I could rely on you and you - correct - comment(s)!


Sorry, Caroline,
it's not the european men, at least not at only!
I definitely remember enough situations in Buenos Aires when I never 
offered big steps, no boleos, no gachos to ('foreign') women ... but they 
still did them. As Tom pointed out: I would, as the argentines do, just 
let them go: give them one tanda - but no more never! 

Caroline,
you're freightend of not getting these sort of dances/feelings anymore 
back 'at home' (whereever you're from) ... and - unfortunately - you're 
feeling the urge to share this and send a message to the world: only 
the argentines can dance, only the argentines can produce these 
feelings ... et cetera ... et cetera ... et cetera ... [the old klischee!]
Actualy: you definitely allready arrived with this sentiments ... and now 
they were confirmed. [in psychology this is called 'self fullfilling 
prophicy'] 
This is not an personal acuse ... in contrast ... but _please_ sit back for 
a moment and think about what you espected from a (male) dancer / 
leader back home before you came out to Bs.As.?!?!?! Didn't you 
espect all that fancy stuff??? And now, as the argentine is not doing it 
... now it great to stay simple! (?!)

In other words: I you (and the other women) would be that open 
towards a non argentine back at home (also read: willing to follow 
_to_the_same_extend_) as you are to the argentine ... 
... you'd probably experience the same back home. 
Or at least you could!


Do not get me wrong: I love Bs.As.! I love being there! (it's a very 
strange feeling to not have been out to Bs.As. this year after three 
years in a row) I love dancing there. But still - and I do share this with 
many other dancers who have been to Bs.As. multiple times / regulary: 
you can get fantastic dancing in Bs.As, that's true. But only if you're 
able to catch the better and the best dancers [which is either because 
you're a good dancer or you're very attractive or you dress up (down?) 
half naked (which after you're observations I would not consider 
concerning your person but have observed this with female tourists 
quite often, not to say regulary] you will have the impressions you 
described ... as there are a lot of (very) bad dancers in Bs.As.! A lot of 
dancers which never would be able to get their shares in ie. european 
milongas ... and if ever only because of the - continuing - female 
misconception of that only an argentine can dance well! 


Therefore - please - : the next time you're going to dance back home 
welcome and embrace the men with the same openhearted feelings 
you were giving the argentines when you arrived in Bs.As. (and now). 
Be ready to give your best (as you do now in Bs.As.): that is _just_ 
_follow_!!!
Yes, there are two important words: "just" and "follow". "follow" is the 
basis for the "just"! Be ready for this experience. Be ready to appriciate 
a beginner/intermediate who's _just_ leadling simple things ... by your 
devotion you will make the leader happy (and a better dancer as you 
know by now!) and also make yourself feeling better!


Caroline: please do _not_ take this message personally ... it is not 
meant to be! It's a hint to all females/followers who are (still) in the 
"argentines by definition dance better" state! 
And one day you will (perhaps) discover that there are _a_lot_ of 
_non_-argentines around who dance a lot better than most of the 
argentines (and most of the non-argentines as well).

And, one thing to realize and not to forget: check out about the lives of 
those who dance that good down in Argentina! Are those folks 'down to 
earth' or are they rather marginal figures??? That to say: check the 
same things / values on your local dancers at home! What would you 
think about an un/half-employed person killing _every_ night at 
milongas into the (late) morning hours???


To some it up: from your posting I presume that you'd be very nice to 
dance with ... and even more after you'd have given up that "argentines 
are better by definition" sentiments!

Continue to enjoy Bs.As. and give the town a little hug from me!
Christian






On 11 Nov 2006 at 14:03, Tom Stermitz wrote:

> Well, those wacky foreign guys are not dancing by themselves.
> 
> 
> Less facetiously...
> 
> You have set up a straw argument, trying to get us to imagine a  
> strange follower who would just do big boleos or ganchos on her own  
> without being led. That's pretty uncommon.
> 
> The steps and navigation are chosen by the man. As Argentines  
> frequently say (apologies for the false cognate), "In tango the man  
> proposes, the woman disposes." But, there are plenty of ways for a  
> woman to dispose poorly. For example, forcing the wrong technique  
> onto the style offered by the leader.
> 
> A woman going to Buenos Aires without the ability to adjust her  
> technique to the style or styles prevalent in the milongas would be  
> labeled as unable to dance. A strong leader could force her to adapt,  
> but she won't get many dances from the better dancers.
> 
> I have certainly heard the same comment ("Wait a minute, Where did  
> you learn? You don't dance like a foreigner"), applied to women who  
> visit argentina. It makes you wonder what their experience has been  
> with foreign women, for them to make such a comment.
> 
> 
> In other words, the same issues about learning how to dance ("the way  
> they do in milongas in Argentina") applies equally to women. Caroline  
> admits that with her first sentence: "I've realized that what I  
> thought I knew about tango, I actually didn't know at all."
> 
> 
> On Nov 11, 2006, at 1:17 PM, Nina Pesochinsky wrote:
> 
> > Hello, Tom, Caroline and everyone,
> >
> > I think that there may need to be a clarification.  It is not that
> > foreigners focus on steps and dance them at the milongas of BsAs, but
> > that it is foreign men that tend to do so.  I have not heard from
> > men, Argentine or not, that foreign women insist on dancing stage
> > tango at the milongas against their partners social dance
> > intentions.  Has anyone?
> >
> > Warm regards,
> >
> > Nina
> 
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