[Tango-L] World Class tango dancers....

[Clif Davis]

Ummmm, let me see how I can reply to this.... ... B.... S.... 
I can't remember where I have seen more arrogance than on this list.
And people say people from the US are arrogant. We have a long way to go to
catch up with this steaming pile.

Oops, sorry, was that arrogant?
CAD3 
-----Original Message-----
From: tango-l-bounces at mit.edu [mailto:tango-l-bounces at mit.edu] On Behalf Of
Nina Pesochinsky
Sent: Tuesday, July 17, 2007 7:15 PM
To: tango-l at mit.edu
Subject: Re: [Tango-L] World Class tango dancers....

Deby,

I just want to clarify that we are not talking about the same 
things.  You are talking about Brazil, Mexico, San Francisco, i.e. 
places that belong to the world.

I am talking about the world of Argentine tango.  The world of 
Argentine tango begins and ends in Argentina.  If it exits, it 
becomes some other world, like the geographic world.  The geographic 
world-class is too low of a standard of dancing.  The Argentine 
world-class is the real thing.

So, in terms of the world-class dancer, with the world beginning and 
ending in Argentina, no other geographic place can produce one.

So one can go to Argentina, into the world of tango that is, and try 
to become a world-class dancer there even if they were not born 
Argentine.  And it still will not happen because of that tiny blemish 
of the wrong origin.

The bottom line is that in order to be considered a true world-class 
dancer, one must be hailed to be so by the Argentines 
themselves.  And if you are not Argneitne, that will never 
happen.  Argentines are fanatical nationalists.

Warmest regards,

Nina






At 05:38 PM 7/17/2007, Deby Novitz wrote:
>Nino wrote:
>
>If you are not Argentine, you cannot be a world-class tango
>dancer and might as well forget about it because the world of tango,
>with all the "classy" dancing,  begins and ends in Argentina.:)  This
>is an absolute.
>
>
>Well Nina, you might want to rethink what you have written.  Junior
>Cervila,  he is in my opinion an excellent dancer and
>from..........Brasil.  The same for Paulo Araujo.  In NYC there is Angel
>Clemente Garcia, one of the best ..... and a Mexican.  There are people
>from other places as well that are wonderful dancers.
>
>I have been dragged and pushed around the floor like a dust mop by
>several Argentine name brands who without a choreographed dance could
>not lead their way out of a dark cave with 1000 lit torches.  There are
>many Argentines who cannot dance gracefully or elegantly.  Sometimes I
>watch them and I cannot for the life of me figure out what people think
>is so great about them other than they speak English, charge lots of
>money, and are arrogant, therefore, they must be good.
>
>Now another myth....there are not a million wonder dancers here.  It is
>all relative.  When I came here in 2000 I thought each and everyone of
>them was wonderful, incredible.  I marveled at what I thought was
>dancing to the music.  Now I live and dance here and I can tell you,
>that here is no better here than there.  (Wherever there is) There are
>maybe less than 10 men I want to dance with.  Here is the
>difference...we have more dancers, more places to dance.  So it might
>seem like there are lots more good dancers.  It is all relative.  If you
>live in Iowa then San Francisco seems like Mecca.  I lived in San
>Francisco and as I commuted to Buenos Aires, San Francisco did not seem
>much like Mecca to me.  The percentages of good dancers "should" be
>higher when there are more dancers....because there are more dancers.
>
>Dancing with bad dancers.  I don't do it.  Not knowingly.  The best
>dancers here male and female sit until they want to dance.  When the
>music is right, when there is someone to dance with.  Once this
>gentleman I know came into the milonga. He came to get me to dance to a
>tanda.  He told me that I was going to be his only tanda of the evening
>and then he was going to leave.  His reason was the women left him
>uninspired.  Maybe this sounds harsh, but this is not unusual here.  One
>night we went to 3 milongas because we as women were uninspired.  We
>were trying to find out where the men were to dance with.  We ended up
>drinking champagne in Gricel.
>
>What happens when I accept a dance with a man who is not that good.    I
>dance with him if he is a nice guy.  It is not his fault we both made a
>mistake.  If he is completely undanceable, at least for me.  I have no
>choice but to end the dance.  To walk off the floor here is an insult to
>one of the parties.  Usually it is a verguenza for the man, not me.
>Here you need to earn the right to walk off the floor.  I can do it, but
>I do not like to.  Not unless the man is a total jerk, or he is hurting
>me with his horrible dancing.  How do I dance with them?  I concentrate
>very hard on my balance and axis to stay upright, and many times I have
>to look at the floor because there is no lead.  Even more so I do not
>dance close embrace if the dancer is really poor.  Then I would really
>be dragged around.  If the man is from the U.S. and used to dancing
>patterns, I have to watch his feet.  I no longer live in the U.S. and
>therefore do not know what patterns are now being taught, so I have to
>figure out the steps before they happen.
>
>The point is that tango is tango.
>
>
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