[Tango-L] Application of Statistics to Tango Teaching

Sat May 12 12:54:05 EDT 2007

Hello Igor,

I'm sure they are people who still teach figures and
patterns, but they tend to be more aware of issues such as
musicality and navigation than those who preceded them 10
or 15 years ago.  I've seen/heard more of them at least
make an attempt at addressing those issues.  This was
Sean's main point.  

We do not just talk to our friends, but we also talk with
dancers from all different levels who come from all over
the U.S and the world.  Many out-of-towners who visit our
milongas or those in nearby cities, folks who move to
Pittsburgh, friends who visit or move to other cities,
local dancers if we're in a different city.  And they come
from different backgrounds and different style preferences.
 Over the years, this has amounted to hundreds of
observations.  Conversations with other organizers who have
been around as long as we have confirm our findings, as
well as, other measurements I sometimes track (such as the
types of workshops being offered on Tango-A).  Enough for a
robust sample.  Keep in mind, Igor, that these issues are
things that I have consciously tracked for years, not
something that I have simply noticed.  Your findings may be
different.  But they should be based on a robust sample. 
Chris did not report using any such sample.

One of the sad things about some on this list is the
apparent intolerance for those who are inexperienced. 
Teachers can be inexperienced, too.  But we see more of
them trying and the internet has been helpful in exposing
different issues.  Not all of the teachers in Pittsburgh
teach musicality, but they try to address it in the way
they hear the music and apply it in their own dance.  At
some level, I think most teachers try to do that, even
though you might not think of it as being musical.  But
consider that one of the tango masters might not consider
anyone on this list to be truly musical.

At a workshop recently, a teacher commented how years ago,
teachers would say "if only people could dance on the
beat".  Now they are saying "think how much better they
could be if they could...".  When is the criticism going to
end?  Why would a beginner want to try to persevere in a
hobby in which nothing seems to be good enough?  Same thing
holds for teachers, deejays, or organizers, as well.

Trini de Pittsburgh

--- Igor Polk <ipolk at virtuar.com> wrote:

> Triny & Sean
> 
> I do not want to be involved into discussion between you
> and Chris, since I
> believe both of you have valid points, but I want to
> clarify a little what
> Chris was pointing out.
> 
> We said you talked, consulted other teachers and that is
> the basis of your
> statistics.
> I believe these people are your friends, dancers sharing
> your view on tango
> teaching.
> Judging about everyone else by the selection of your
> personal statistical
> source is bound to fail because it is faulty by
> definition.
> 
> I bet there are at least 40 people teaching tango in San
> Francisco Bay Area.
> How many of them did you discussed the problem with?
> Frankly, I'd rather be on the Chris's side in the
> conclusion: most teachers
> do not teach dancing. Or they are not able to. One has to
> be a great dancer
> himself to be able to teach dancing. Otherwise he just
> does not know what it
> is..
> 
> There are many people on the list who teach, I believe.
> Did you consult all
> of them?
> 
> I do not know the answer, but it seems to me no.
> There are still a lot of teachers teaching figures in the
> most dumb sense.
> And there are several school who do not like each other
> very much. And there
> are a lot of great teachers teaching dancing but not the
> way you would like,
> so the idea of discussing tango teaching problems would
> not even come to
> your mind. And there are a lot of young people who have
> something to say,
> you just do not know about them.
> 
> Forgive me, if I am wrong...
> 
> Igor Polk.
> The idea of teaching dancing instead of teaching figures
> is fascinating, but
> then what?
> 
> PS.
> Not in any way I want to criticize the local organizers
> who struggle to
> promote tango in their places. It is better to have
> something, so they talk
> about whatever they know and the way they know. And this
> is good. Someone
> has to show the direction. They are not teachers they are
> Visionaries ! They
> bring people to tango.
> 
> It is better to teach figures than nothing, it is the
> easiest way. So that
> then, the traveling real teaching dancer can come and fix
> it. Make it a real
> tango, make it dancing.
> 
> Many people have dancing abilities. They do not need to
> be taught dancing.
> They only need to know about specific moves, philosophy,
> methods, concepts,
> and rituals. They need a place to practice to different
> sorts of music. Then
> they will figure it out themselves how to dance it. It
> might be not your
> way, so what !?
> 
> 
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> 

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