[Tango-L] Tango in flames...

Tue Jun 26 05:19:05 EDT 2007

I do hope you all dance as well as you flame.
This list is almost Jerry Springer at times...

"Make ochos not war."

'Mash
London,UK

On Mon, Jun 25, 2007 at 11:15:53PM -0500, Clif Davis wrote:
> Hit the delete key Keith. Ming bai wo shuo ma
> 
> I think it is funny how people who think they are so much better than
> everyone else want to control those they think are lesser beings. 
> 
> Oh, don't worry about me, I am just one of those slug Americans you despise
> so much.
> Clif
> 
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: tango-l-bounces at mit.edu [mailto:tango-l-bounces at mit.edu] On Behalf Of
> Keith
> Sent: Monday, June 25, 2007 10:48 PM
> To: tango-l at mit.edu
> Subject: Re: [Tango-L] SFTX - The Exchange
> 
> Miles,
> 
> Can you please give it a rest; I'm starting to get a little tired of seeing
> your name in my mailbox.
> 
> You've been learning Tango for 8-months and you've NEVER been to Buenos
> Aires. Which, in my 
> book, means you know next-to-nothing. And yet you seem to think you're
> qualified to 
> lecture people on this list on what NEVER happens in Tango, what SHOULD
> happen in Tango
> and how things should CHANGE.
> 
> I used to admire your self-confidence, but now it's getting tiresome. If
> people want to read what
> you have to say, I think we all know your blog address by now.
> 
> And, from your previous message - there are NO American Tango Gods. If all
> you know about 
> Tango is what you've seen or learned from American dancers and teachers,
> well - as I said above
>  - you've seen and learned next-to-nothing. My advice - stop wasting your
> time and money on Daniel 
> Tenner, and other American teachers, and get yourself down to Buenos Aires.
> It really is the 
> ONLY way to learn Tango at the level you so obviously want. American
> teachers are big fish in 
> a very small Tango pool. So the question is, Miles - do you want to dance
> with the Goldfish or with 
> the Sharks? 
> 
> Keith, HK
> 
> 
> 
>  On Tue Jun 26  8:00 , m i l e s  sent:
> 
> >(from TangoBliss.com)
> >
> >The Exchange Itself
> >
> >Many have asked this same question, what is a "tango exchange" ? My  
> >response to that question is somewhat of a derivation of an idea of  
> >what Homer had in mind. I like to think of the answer to that  
> >question this way:
> >
> >First let me tell you that the Exchange is NOT a bunch of classes  
> >that you sign up for and then stand around in a circle while a  
> >teacher leads you through a series of patterns. Truth be told I hate  
> >that format for learning tango. There has to be a better way. There  
> >just has to be.
> >
> >The Exchange is also not a critique session of what you're doing  
> >wrong or right. It never ventures there. The Exchange focuses on  
> >possibilities, variations on a theme, and errs on the side that  
> >everyone (and I do mean everyone) has something valuable to impart  
> >either in the form of a question, an idea, a thought, or a consequence..
> >
> >The idea for the Exchange is something that so rarely happens in  
> >Tango, most definitely NEVER at a Milonga, and almost never at an  
> >actual practica with MULTIPLE partners, and damned never NEVER in a  
> >group class, and not ever in a private.
> >
> >And what is that something ? Its the open sharing of knowledge. It  
> >just doesn't happen. Stop and think about it for a moment. In what  
> >other context do you 'share' your knowledge of tango, your  
> >experiences, your successes, your failures, your explorations...? Now  
> >add to that question, at what other time in your tango experience  
> >have you sat with like-minded souls and not just talked tango (which  
> >we all do till the wee hour of the morning at many a festival or all  
> >night milongas), but actually worked on movements and sensations,  
> >feelings, and patterns. Now add to that again with a large enough  
> >group, say anywhere from 20 - 30 ppl of leads and follows. Where  
> >leads work with leads as follows, and or follows, and followers work  
> >with leads as leads and followers. When does this 'sharing' of  
> >knowledge happen ? Almost never. Its never concentrated in one place  
> >and its never more than on a one on one basis with your local  
> >practice partners. Never on a grand scale. Never.
> >
> >In Argentine Tango, the keepers of the knowledge (teachers) have to  
> >make a living somehow and they hold that knowledge unless of course  
> >you pay for their time and their expertise.
> >
> >In a group class you can ask questions of the teachers, but engaging  
> >the class in an active discussion and exploration of a given topic or  
> >even a wide array of topics, not bloody likely.
> >
> >In a private you can ask questions of a teacher and their experience  
> >of the material and sometimes you'll get what they're yapping about  
> >and sometimes you won't but still you're paying for the experience  
> >regardless of your level of success (I don't know that many  
> >professions where you get paid no matter whether you fail or succeed  
> >in your task.  If tango teachers were paid on level of performance of  
> >their students and not the time involved in teaching I think we might  
> >see a slight shift in priorities)...
> >
> >In a private practice session its one on one. You, your partner, the  
> >music and a dance floor. And usually its, in my experience, limited  
> >as that may be, where one person is directing the traffic of what  
> >they want to work on. Its never bi-directional. And not more than  
> >once a week, unless you're me (in which case its 4 to 5 times a week).
> >
> >So the Exchange fills that gap...kinda.
> >
> >Truth be told though from my perspective it can not fill that gap.
> >
> >The reason is because it doesn't happen enough, once a year just  
> >doesn't cut it folks. How often do the Tango Brethren in the United  
> >States get together (and I don't mean at a social tango festival) ?  
> >How often does that happen ? Damned near never. Sure at a festival  
> >you see the 'teachers' huddled together and dancing the entire time  
> >with each other and rarely do they deign to look in your general  
> >direction (and rightfully so when you stop and think about WHY that's  
> >so). But an open exchange of tango knowledge ? Not happening. And  
> >certainly not in a class room environment.
> >
> >Tango has traditionally from the various sources I've discussed this  
> >with been kept a secret art for some reason. Those who have the  
> >knowledge hoard it. Those that don't must come to the keepers of the  
> >flame and pay homage, whilst sucking up, one may or may not gain that  
> >which one seeks, as far as tango knowledge goes because in the end  
> >you must integrate what you have learned. And ultimately its up to  
> >you to make it all work.
> >
> >The exchange seeks to change that for 4 days out of the year and  
> >hopefully change the paradigm a bit, slowly.
> >_______________________________________________
> >Tango-L mailing list
> >Tango-L at mit.edu
> >http://mailman.mit.edu/mailman/listinfo/tango-l
> 
> 
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