[Tango-A] ADMIN: Responses to Tango-A survey (Should Tango-A continue?)

[Shahrukh Merchant]

Responses to Tango-A survey (Should Tango-A continue?)

[NOTE: While normally this list is for announcements only, with 
discussion normally limited to the Tango-L list, since this pertains to 
the ultimate fate of Tango-A, please feel free to post comments or 
discussion on this topic here on Tango-A.

I have disabled the Topic feature, so there is no need to put a special 
prefix in the subject line (like MISC: or NA-E: or whatever) if you are 
discussing the continuation of this list, although of course if you are 
actually posting an event you may continue to use the prefix as a 
helpful convention.]

About 10 days ago, I posted a survey on whether Tango-A should continue. 
There were 77 responses (after consolidating 5 apparent multiple 
submissions). Thank you all for taking the time for responding. Many of 
you took the time to write some well-thought-out comments, which are 
particularly appreciated.

More than half the respondents to the survey were Tango organizers. I 
think this group will find the general comments at the end of this email 
most useful to see what media other organizers use or find most useful 
for getting the word out.

Here are the questions and the responses (percentages have been rounded 
to the closest 5%):

1. How do you usually handle Tango-A posts that come into your mailbox?
    65% Scan subject or email
    20% Read in its entirety
    10% Just delete it unread
     5% Can't remember when I last received Tango-A email

2. How many Tango events have you gone to in the last 2 years that you 
WOULD NOT HAVE KNOWN ABOUT (or known about much later) if it weren't for 
Tango-A?
    60% None
    35% 1-3
     5% 6 or more

3. Do you think Tango-A should continue?
    55% Yes
    35% No
    10% Not sure or no reply

    Specific Comments:
    - For me no, but if there are still people appreciating it
    - whatever is best 4 u
    - I am indifferent as I no longer dance tango
    - Move to Facebook
    - Perhaps a searchable form?
    - The list is only useful if people use it, not only to post events 
but to find them.  There are so many events these days and so relatively 
few posts on Tango-A that I suspect people now are finding information 
in other ways.
    - It seems outdated

4. If Tango-A were to move to another server, which would require you to 
resubscribe, would you do so?
    60% Yes
    25% No
    15% Maybe

    Specific comments:
    - Maybe. I've found that there is too much I'm not interested in. If 
there were a way to select and change selection according to areas 
(geographic) of interest at different times, that would be great. I've 
wasn't end to unsubscribe to certain lists snd nevere really knew how to 
do it. Years ago I followed some process to do that and wasn't 
successful so I give up and dealt with deleting from daily mail.
    - Yes, as long as it does not cost anything and does not involve 
Facebook, Google, etc.
    - I'm not sure; it might depend on the results of this survey.  It 
would be nice to have you post the results.
    - Not sure due to reach/effectiveness

5. Tango Organizers: Do you announce your events on Tango-A?
    50% (of respondents): Yes
    50% (of respondents): No
    (Note: About 60% of respondents identified themselves as organizers)

6. Tango Organizers: If yes, how many attendees do you think you've 
received IN THE LAST YEAR because of your announcements on Tango-A (THAT 
YOU WOULDN'T HAVE OTHEWISE)?
    60% None
    20% 1-5
    10% 5-10
    10% 11 or more

7. Tango Organizers: If no, why not?
    35% Don't think anyone reads it
    35% Posts didn't appear so stopped bothering
    30% Other (see comments below)

    Specific comments:
    - Used to post
    - I forget
    - Didn't track it
    - People get tired of reading the "same" posts
    - We already connected most of local dancers on FB
    - My events (past) were not a long-distance draw, but others are
    - I have been unable to track that people are coming as a result of 
Tango-A announcements. Nowadays, I suspect few people even know about 
Tango-A
    - Facebook, TangoMango and e-mails lists seem to cover everyone we 
need to reach out to


GENERAL COMMENTS

- Apart from the case of migrating to a  new server, no additional work 
seems to be involved for end users with the current arrangements, so let 
sleeping dogs lie. FB etc is good, but old fashioned EM distbn lists 
have their place too.

- Tango-A is useful!

- With due respect for your effort, I think Tango-A has outlived its 
purpose. Please unsubscribe me. [Ed. no email address was provided but 
see www.tango-L.com for unsubscription information]

- Hello Shahrukh, I would like to tell you how much I have appreciated 
Tango-A, and the work you've done, over the years.  There was a time 
when Tango-A was probably the only way to get information about tango 
events to world-wide tango community and it was absolutely invaluable. 
Now, there are many other methods, like facebook, etc and perhaps 
Tango-A does not serve as important a role as it once did.  However, I 
do not think it has outlived it's usefulness and I, for one, would 
welcome its continuation.  Thanks again for all of your contributions to 
our community at large! [Tango organizer - name redacted]

- It's rubbish. No excitement. All the honest and true posters have been 
chastised by God-Almighty Shahruk in his infinite wisdom. - It's 
useless. Simply and ego-boosting exercise for the 'owner' of the List. - 
Hierarchical nonsense. [Ed. Last three comments, combined here, were 
evidently posted by the same person, presumably confusing this list with 
Tango-L, where abusers tended to have more emotional reactions to 
moderation--see results of the Tango-L survey for comments on moderation 
there. Tango-A moderation, such as it was, consisted mostly of pointing 
out geographical prefix and similar formatting errors.]

- I use Tango-A and Tango-L and appreciate them very much. [Tango 
organizer - name redacted]

- Annoyingly Bureaucratic [Ed. Yes, I suppose by today's standards, the 
pickines on exact formatting for geographical prefixes, length 
limitations, etc., would be annoying ...]

- A national Tango A list is very convenient, it seems like social web 
sites i.e. Face Book are the means of web social interactions. However I 
am not confident that FB can provide the richness needed for a Tango A 
like, social media.

- Unfortunately, after facebook, Google and other social media, tango-A 
and L lost their usefulness.

- Either global network of a non-partisan, or commercial bulletin board 
where everyone can go to and get reliable info may be useful, but that 
would require a lot of manpower. I'm not sure what's most useful, 
efficient way connecting with the ever growing tango community, but the 
current tango-A & L are not the answer.

- Thank you for years of service, Shahrukh! [name redacted]

- Most events are not of interest to us.  It is a big country. BUT the 
occasional event occurs that we are willing to travel a great distance 
for. Out of town percentages are probably pretty low. But even one out 
of town guest is more that zero.  If the organizers don't post it, how 
are we going to know about it?

- Old school, but important addition to my small ad budget!

- It's always good to know whats happening in all the tango world

- I may not be representative - since I've had kids I am completley out 
of organising and mostly out of dancing (unfortunately :-) )
However, if you stop, thanks a lot for doing it all these years from a 
tango dinosaur [Former Tango organizer - name redacted]

- At this point it is the only vehicle that gives me a realistic idea of 
what is available outside my immediate location. I actually consider 
it's content when planning trips

- Whenever I travel, I consult my saved notices and try to include a 
Milonga and lesson in my trip, as tango is limited at home. I think it's 
a really good thing, especially for workshops by visiting teachers.

- Utter rubbish!

- Most tango organizers and teachers are now using facebook. However, 
the events, milongas, and classes get lost in the huge amount of other 
non-event posting (my cat, your cat, etc.)  Many of the organizers and 
instructors posting are posting photos of promo cards, but it seems that 
they do not understand that posting a picture of a card is not the same 
as posting text, because browsers (like google) can't read a promo card, 
however pretty it is. ... I was surprised at how many websites there are 
out there.  However the tango postings on the net have become a tower of 
babble which is getting worse, not better. Plus the Tango-A and L 
archives are a very valuable resource.  Thanks for your work on this. 
Most of the major cities are covered by some sort of calender, but if 
you are traveling it can still be hard to find a good milonga. [name 
redacted]

- It appears that tango event announcements are fewer than in the past. 
  Wish more organizers would make their events announced here. And thank 
you.

- Thank you so much for Tango-A. When it started, it was for sure a 
very, very useful vehicle.  I think at this point, I find it interesting 
to see what is happening, but you are right, prob doesn't affect my 
attendance and I rarely use it any more.  If we had a big event I 
would... I am fine either way, but please know before Facebook, it 
really was essential, so am very grateful to you for it's inception.  I 
am a tango dinosaur, started in 1993 [Tango organizer - name redacted]

- Tango A and Tango L was great and I miss the discussions of aspects of 
tango.

- I posted a good comment in previous question. Thank you

- Shahrukh, I really appreciate all you do. Perhaps I will actually run 
into you on one of my trips to Bs. As. sometime. I deactivated Facebook, 
so less Internet noise but I do like the lists, as well as BA Newcomer 
emails daily. [name redacted]

- I had a hard time getting my post to appear in tango-a and have not 
been able to understand why. I would love to have a mean to send 
announcements that go beyond my current community. I am organizing 
events that would be of interest for a larger audience and it is quite 
hard to reach all over the US. It would be nice to have something that 
goes on Facebook as well that is related to tango-a and set up a 
campaign so that people knows more about tango-a. Thank you for all your 
effort I would hate to loose this historic venue of communication

- I use Tango-A to advertise my Buenos Aires apartment, so the last two 
questions are not applicable.

- It is a nice idea but times have changed and people use websites, FB 
etc. I don't post my events on it. Thanks for doing it.

- Submitting announcements is very complicated and hard to figure out. 
It should be much more straight forward to be able to submit 
announcements.  All other online promo options that I have ever used are 
much easier to work with.

- There are a number of similar pages on Facebook, e.g. Tango Marathons 
Directory (Facebook+Web) but this list probably has a somewhat older and 
pre-facebook audience.  Maybe they would finally migrate their events 
and presence to that realm.  It would be nice to keep track of all tango 
events in the same format.

- It's not a bad resource. It does list events that take place outside 
my home town (NYC), which I probably wouldn't know about otherwise. But 
I don't travel much for tango.

- The formatting of sending emails becomes disorganized when submitting 
and hard to read as a result. Perhaps improving formatting would result 
in higher amount of read emails

- Hi Shahrukh -- this is [name redacted], I've been on this list for 16 
years so I can say it has been a good resource for me especially in the 
early days. Nowadays not so much since most event announcements are via 
FB or Twitter.  I guess Tango-A is declining just the same as Tango-L. 
Back then almost all the English speaking tangueros were on this 
platform, there is a great deal of excitement and synergy.  It is a pity 
that everything is very diffused now, so one can hardly get a pulse of 
the tango world. For me Tango-A's main value is a place to track what 
different communities are doing and where the pros are flying to next. 
As an organiser myself I often use this information strategically. So 
while I don't read and act on every post, I like the fact that it stays 
in my inbox and I can go back and search for a name later. I am a 
software developer so please keep me in the loop if you decide to 
revitalise Tango-L/Tango-A with a new platform, I can probably 
contribute some code.

- keep it going.

- I'd send my tango events but they didn't appear

- Hi Shahrukh, We don't post to tango-A as much as we should, cause 
every time we do we notice a few (1-4) sales. (we do shoes only now, no 
events) I would like to see it continue another 6 months to a year. 
After that we will be well established and it won't matter any longer. 
Thanks for asking and thanks for all the work you've done on these 
listservs over the years! [Tango organizer - name redacted]

- I'm afraid times have changed.  Social networking now plays a much 
larger role in connecting people and events than it did when the Tango-A 
list was initially established.  And there are so many events nowadays 
that people sometimes just track favorite instructors schedules or pick 
geographic locations they's like to visit and then follow up with social 
media or local community website links and resources to learn about and 
register for events they'd like to attend. The utility of Tango-A, once 
very useful, does seem to have diminished.

- One of the things that makes posting on FB so much easier is that I 
don't have to wait for administrative approval. In the past I have been 
frustrated because my posts to Tango-A weren't in the proper font.

- Tango-A is useful for announcing events nationally, for visitors to 
another city.  But for local announcements Facebook and TangoMango seem 
to work very well.

- It seems like most of the tango events are announced on Facebook these 
days.  I tend to get my information from FB or the organizers directly. 
  Not sure what advice to give, given that social media dominates. It 
may be worth looking at listserv analytics i.e. how many new 
subscribers, how many new subscribers posting, how many old subscribers 
posting etc. Maybe connecting the listserv to social media?  I hope that 
helps. [name redacted]

- Some years ago I had difficulty posting news of my tango-related book 
releases. They were flagged and I had to repost after convincing the 
admin it wasn't spam. That said, .]I think tango-a is useful and I would 
be sad to see it go. Thanks for providing this survey. [Ed. That must 
have been a long time ago in the early days of Tango-A when events were 
all that were anticipated. But yes, a category MISC: was subsequently 
added for those selling Tango shoes or books or other merchandise, as 
well as those renting apartments in Buenos Aires]

- PLEASE CONTINUE....a good thing for the Tango world.

- I am not a Tango Organizer. I think Tango-A still serves a valuable 
purpose. I receive Tango-A emails and I do not often read them, but I 
know they are there in case I want to find out about an event anywhere 
in the world. In today's world, it's just another resource, to be sure. 
But I think it is an important and valuable resource. I would like to 
see it continue, whether on the MIT server or somewhere else.

END