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<BODY lang=EN-US vLink=purple link=blue>
<DIV><SPAN class=930073713-15122009><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff size=2>Thanks
guys</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=930073713-15122009><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff
size=2></FONT></SPAN> </DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=930073713-15122009><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff
size=2>Obviously, I would *never* **ever** consider direct database... um
"adjustments"... to overcome development issues of this nature! I suppose the
preferred option would be to identify the missing objects during testing, and
then update the bindings to use new (upgrade resilient) data types in prod, so
that by the time production is upgraded, only 'correctly bound' workflows are
in-flight. </FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=930073713-15122009><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff
size=2></FONT></SPAN> </DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=930073713-15122009></SPAN><SPAN class=930073713-15122009><FONT
face=Arial color=#0000ff size=2>However, I'm sure that there are some examples
where this approach is insufficient or inappropriate. I</FONT></SPAN><SPAN
class=930073713-15122009><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff size=2>s the
described scenario below pretty much an exhaustive description of the
problems that in-flight workflows experienced (plus the fixes employed), or is
this just one of a selection of issues?</FONT> </SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=930073713-15122009><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff
size=2></FONT></SPAN> </DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=930073713-15122009><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff
size=2>Cheers</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><SPAN class=930073713-15122009><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff
size=2>Andy</FONT></SPAN></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial color=#0000ff size=2></FONT><BR> </DIV>
<DIV class=OutlookMessageHeader lang=en-us dir=ltr align=left>
<HR tabIndex=-1>
<FONT face=Tahoma size=2><B>From:</B> sap-wug-bounces@mit.edu
[mailto:sap-wug-bounces@mit.edu] <B>On Behalf Of </B>Alon Raskin<BR><B>Sent:</B>
Wednesday 09 December 2009 17:50<BR><B>To:</B> SAP Workflow Users'
Group<BR><B>Subject:</B> RE: Workflow Upgrade issues (4.6c to ECC
6)<BR></FONT><BR></DIV>
<DIV></DIV>
<DIV class=Section1>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 11pt; COLOR: #1f497d; FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'">That
Alon guy is a cowboy. No wonder he lives in Texas!<o:p></o:p></SPAN></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 11pt; COLOR: #1f497d; FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'">Imagine
that! Reusing an SAP delivered data element. Will the horrors ever
cease….<o:p></o:p></SPAN></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 11pt; COLOR: #1f497d; FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'"><o:p> </o:p></SPAN></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 11pt; COLOR: #1f497d; FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'"><o:p> </o:p></SPAN></P>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><B><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 11pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'">Alon
Raskin</SPAN></B><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: #1f497d; FONT-FAMILY: 'Verdana','sans-serif'"><o:p></o:p></SPAN></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><B><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 11pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'">e:</SPAN></B><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 11pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'"> <B><A
title="mailto:araskin@3i-consulting.com blocked::mailto:araskin@3i-consulting.com"
href="mailto:araskin@3i-consulting.com">araskin@3i-consulting.com</A></B></SPAN><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: #1f497d; FONT-FAMILY: 'Verdana','sans-serif'"><o:p></o:p></SPAN></P></DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 11pt; COLOR: #1f497d; FONT-FAMILY: 'Calibri','sans-serif'"><o:p> </o:p></SPAN></P>
<DIV>
<DIV
style="BORDER-RIGHT: medium none; PADDING-RIGHT: 0in; BORDER-TOP: #b5c4df 1pt solid; PADDING-LEFT: 0in; PADDING-BOTTOM: 0in; BORDER-LEFT: medium none; PADDING-TOP: 3pt; BORDER-BOTTOM: medium none">
<P class=MsoNormal><B><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Tahoma','sans-serif'">From:</SPAN></B><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Tahoma','sans-serif'">
sap-wug-bounces@mit.edu [mailto:sap-wug-bounces@mit.edu] <B>On Behalf Of
</B>Mike Gambier<BR><B>Sent:</B> Wednesday, December 09, 2009 10:32
AM<BR><B>To:</B> sap-wug@mit.edu<BR><B>Subject:</B> RE: Workflow Upgrade issues
(4.6c to ECC 6)<o:p></o:p></SPAN></P></DIV></DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Verdana','sans-serif'">Andy,<BR> <BR>The
surgery was required on the Workflow Container definitions themselves,
specifically where non-existent Data Dictionary types were discovered to be the
root cause of some abnormal behaviour.<BR> <BR>We found that we had live WF
instances of some definitions that compiled just fine pre-upgrade that all
of a sudden fell over in ECC 6 because they wanted to use some data
elements/fields that had simply vanished because of the upgrade.
<BR> <BR>In our case the things that went missing were actually in
SAP's namespace so we couldn't stop them from disappearing, i.e. some of
our WF developers (*ahem* Alon Raskin, not mentioning any names of course!) had
made use of an old SAP data type that ended up being zapped from
DDIC.<BR> <BR>So let's just say that a few 'adjustments' (direct
hacks) needed to be made post-upgrade to some SAP tables like
SWDSBINDEF (specifically fields REFSTRUCT & REFFIELD) to allow the
errored WFs to be restarted and 'find' the correct data type to use going
forward.<BR> <BR>Regards,<BR> <BR>Mike
GT<BR> <o:p></o:p></SPAN></P>
<DIV class=MsoNormal style="TEXT-ALIGN: center" align=center><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Verdana','sans-serif'">
<HR id=stopSpelling align=center width="100%" SIZE=2>
</SPAN></DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal style="MARGIN-BOTTOM: 12pt"><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Verdana','sans-serif'">Subject: RE:
Workflow Upgrade issues (4.6c to ECC 6)<BR>Date: Wed, 9 Dec 2009 09:01:33
-0700<BR>From: andy.m.catherall@cadbury.com<BR>To:
sap-wug@mit.edu<o:p></o:p></SPAN></P>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN class=ecx868155315-09122009><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: blue; FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'">Thanks
Mike</SPAN></SPAN><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Verdana','sans-serif'"><o:p></o:p></SPAN></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Verdana','sans-serif'"> <o:p></o:p></SPAN></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN class=ecx868155315-09122009><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: blue; FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'">I'm
still unclear on a fundamental point:</SPAN></SPAN><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Verdana','sans-serif'"><o:p></o:p></SPAN></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Verdana','sans-serif'"> <o:p></o:p></SPAN></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN class=ecx868155315-09122009><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Verdana','sans-serif'">"...although we did
have to perform a few surgical procedures on a few definitions to resolve the
odd bug here and there. And for the record we did NOT kill all of our active
instances at all. "</SPAN></SPAN><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Verdana','sans-serif'"><o:p></o:p></SPAN></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Verdana','sans-serif'"> <o:p></o:p></SPAN></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN class=ecx868155315-09122009><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: blue; FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'">These
two statements appear to be mutually exclusive (unless I am *really* missing
something).</SPAN></SPAN><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Verdana','sans-serif'"><o:p></o:p></SPAN></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Verdana','sans-serif'"> <o:p></o:p></SPAN></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN class=ecx868155315-09122009><U><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: blue; FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'">A
typical scenario</SPAN></U></SPAN><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Verdana','sans-serif'"><o:p></o:p></SPAN></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN class=ecx868155315-09122009><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: blue; FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'">* We
have some WF_1 instances running version_1 on a 4.6c PROD
machine</SPAN></SPAN><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Verdana','sans-serif'"><o:p></o:p></SPAN></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN class=ecx868155315-09122009><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: blue; FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'">* We
take a copy of prod (for test purposes)</SPAN></SPAN><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Verdana','sans-serif'"><o:p></o:p></SPAN></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN class=ecx868155315-09122009><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: blue; FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'">* We
test these running instances of WF_1 and find a bug... lets say, in the
bindings.</SPAN></SPAN><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Verdana','sans-serif'"><o:p></o:p></SPAN></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN class=ecx868155315-09122009><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: blue; FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'">* We
make a fix to resolve this issue in our ECC6 landscape. WF_1 has been
reactivated and a transport created.</SPAN></SPAN><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Verdana','sans-serif'"><o:p></o:p></SPAN></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN class=ecx868155315-09122009><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: blue; FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'">*
...</SPAN></SPAN><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Verdana','sans-serif'"><o:p></o:p></SPAN></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN class=ecx868155315-09122009><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: blue; FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'">* Some
time later, we finally go live. The production environment is upgraded and the
'fix' transports are uploaded.</SPAN></SPAN><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Verdana','sans-serif'"><o:p></o:p></SPAN></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN class=ecx868155315-09122009><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: blue; FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'">* The
active instances of WF_1 at version_1 (which started just prior to the
upgrade) will run into the bug. Any new instances will now start version_2, and
hence be bug-free (hopefully!).</SPAN></SPAN><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Verdana','sans-serif'"><o:p></o:p></SPAN></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Verdana','sans-serif'"> <o:p></o:p></SPAN></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN class=ecx868155315-09122009><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: blue; FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'">Where
did the surgical procedures take place such that active instances were able to
continue after the upgrade? In the 4.6c environment, in advance of the
upgrade?</SPAN></SPAN><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Verdana','sans-serif'"><o:p></o:p></SPAN></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Verdana','sans-serif'"> <o:p></o:p></SPAN></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN class=ecx868155315-09122009><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: blue; FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'">Thanks
again</SPAN></SPAN><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Verdana','sans-serif'"><o:p></o:p></SPAN></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN class=ecx868155315-09122009><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: blue; FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'">Andy</SPAN></SPAN><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Verdana','sans-serif'"><o:p></o:p></SPAN></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Verdana','sans-serif'"> <o:p></o:p></SPAN></P></DIV>
<DIV class=MsoNormal style="TEXT-ALIGN: center" align=center><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Verdana','sans-serif'">
<HR align=center width="100%" SIZE=2>
</SPAN></DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal style="MARGIN-BOTTOM: 12pt"><B><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Tahoma','sans-serif'">From:</SPAN></B><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Tahoma','sans-serif'">
sap-wug-bounces@mit.edu [mailto:sap-wug-bounces@mit.edu] <B>On Behalf Of
</B>Mike Gambier<BR><B>Sent:</B> Wednesday 09 December 2009 14:30<BR><B>To:</B>
sap-wug@mit.edu<BR><B>Subject:</B> RE: Workflow Upgrade issues (4.6c to ECC
6)</SPAN><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Verdana','sans-serif'"><o:p></o:p></SPAN></P>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Verdana','sans-serif'">Hi
Andy,<BR> <BR>I'm glad you found the thread useful :)<BR> <BR>Several
months on from the upgrade and I'm pleased to say we've made the transition to
an ECC 6 platform without too much fallout, so in the immortal words on the
HG2G book "Don't Panic!". <BR> <BR>Nothing went drastically wrong, although
we did have to perform a few surgical procedures on a few definitions to resolve
the odd bug here and there. And for the record we did NOT kill all of our active
instances at all. Instead we had millions of them waking up and playing with the
new Workflow engine code reasonable natively. The only ones that had problems
'wakng up' were typically ones that were trying to invoke standard SAP Functions
that had been zapped in during the upgrade, e.g.
SWW_BI_EXECUTE_S_NEW.<BR> <BR>Probably the best thing you can do is scan
through <STRONG><SPAN style="FONT-FAMILY: 'Verdana','sans-serif'">OSS Note
1068627</SPAN></STRONG> and prepare for some thorough testing prior to the big
day.<BR> <BR>Provided you don't intend to import Workflow definition
changes from a 4.6c (or earlier) system into an ECC 6 one <U>on a continuous
basis</U>, as we did, you should find your definitions probably only need to be
looked at a couple of times before they bed down. You might want to create 'new'
versions in your development environments just to be sure you can differentiate
between new instances and old ones but it wasn't actually necessary in most
cases. Just good practice really.<BR> <BR>Perhaps the biggest concern we
had (and continue to have) is the use of the XML container and the persistence
profile at our volumes. Simply put, we have not switched to the new tables at
all. Mostly because we rely heavily on being able to 'find' objects in Workflow
containers for exception and monitoring processes and so need stuff to still be
in SWW_CONTOB. All of which means we have religiously set our Persistence
Profile to the 'Structured' setting which forces the code to use the 'old'
container tables.<BR> <BR>Having said that our PI system is merrily using
ccBPM stuff (essentially that means Workflow) and is using the XML
Container tables, albeit at significantly lower volumes.<BR><BR>Pretty soon
we'll complete the holy trinity and have Workflows running in our new SAP CRM
7.0 system too. Which will mean WF-BATCH whizzing along in 3 different SAP
systems and 3 different ABAP codestacks all at the same time. Oh joy...
:)<BR> <BR>Regards,<BR> <BR>Mike GT<BR> <o:p></o:p></SPAN></P>
<DIV class=MsoNormal style="TEXT-ALIGN: center" align=center><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Verdana','sans-serif'">
<HR id=ecxstopSpelling align=center width="100%" SIZE=2>
</SPAN></DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal style="MARGIN-BOTTOM: 12pt"><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Verdana','sans-serif'">Subject: RE:
Workflow Upgrade issues (4.6c to ECC 6)<BR>Date: Wed, 9 Dec 2009 05:56:13
-0700<BR>From: andy.m.catherall@cadbury.com<BR>To:
sap-wug@mit.edu<o:p></o:p></SPAN></P>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN class=ecxecx156511519-08122009><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: blue; FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'">Hi
all</SPAN></SPAN><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Verdana','sans-serif'"><o:p></o:p></SPAN></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Verdana','sans-serif'"> <o:p></o:p></SPAN></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN class=ecxecx156511519-08122009><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: blue; FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'">Apologies
for resurrecting an old thread... I'm working my way through all the
upgrade-lesson posts, as we are now finally moving from 4.6c to ECC6. I too have
recognised this "Do I *really* have to end all my workflow
instances/business processes!?!" dilemma, and am trying to understand the
subtle</SPAN></SPAN><SPAN class=ecxecx562264707-09122009><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: blue; FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'">ties</SPAN></SPAN><SPAN
class=ecxecx156511519-08122009><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: blue; FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'"> behind
it. This thread seemed a very pertinent place to ask my
question</SPAN></SPAN><SPAN class=ecxecx562264707-09122009><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: blue; FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'">s</SPAN></SPAN><SPAN
class=ecxecx156511519-08122009><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: blue; FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'">.</SPAN></SPAN><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Verdana','sans-serif'"><o:p></o:p></SPAN></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Verdana','sans-serif'"> <o:p></o:p></SPAN></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN class=ecxecx156511519-08122009><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: blue; FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'">I really
appreciate all the lessons which have been put on this forum with respect to WF
upgrades... from this, I get the strong impression that there may be a multitude
of bugs, issues and associated corrections to workflow definitions,
bindings, the 'block structure' etc, in support of ECC6. I am witnessing a
number of these issues in our test environment, and they are impacted both
in-flight instances & new instances.</SPAN></SPAN><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Verdana','sans-serif'"><o:p></o:p></SPAN></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Verdana','sans-serif'"> <o:p></o:p></SPAN></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN class=ecxecx156511519-08122009><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: blue; FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'">Many of
these fixes will result in new versions of the workflow design: So, for example,
if I identify & fix a binding issue in my ECC6 test environment, I will
have to re-activate the workflow and promote the change into production at
cut-over. This instantly means that any workflows might be in-progress during
the cut-over weekend will be not be 'valid' in the new environment, because they
will not be running the corrected version. Further, we may have to change an
object or method such that old versions of the workflow cannot successfully call
it... Again, in-flight workflow instances are the living-dead; we know they will
not continue after the upgrade.</SPAN></SPAN><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Verdana','sans-serif'"><o:p></o:p></SPAN></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Verdana','sans-serif'"> <o:p></o:p></SPAN></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Verdana','sans-serif'"> <o:p></o:p></SPAN></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN class=ecxecx156511519-08122009><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: blue; FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'">That all
made sense to me and my little understanding of the universe... and I can
foresee having to forewarn the business of this. They will by very impressed,
I'm sure!</SPAN></SPAN><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Verdana','sans-serif'"><o:p></o:p></SPAN></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Verdana','sans-serif'"> <o:p></o:p></SPAN></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN class=ecxecx156511519-08122009><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: blue; FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'">However,
there are hints in th</SPAN></SPAN><SPAN class=ecxecx968284307-09122009><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: blue; FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'">is thread
- and other similar</SPAN></SPAN><SPAN class=ecxecx156511519-08122009><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: blue; FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'"> </SPAN></SPAN><SPAN
class=ecxecx968284307-09122009><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: blue; FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'">ones -
</SPAN></SPAN><SPAN class=ecxecx156511519-08122009><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: blue; FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'">of
people somehow managing to cajole their workflow instances into continuing
across the upgrade boundary...</SPAN></SPAN><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Verdana','sans-serif'"><o:p></o:p></SPAN></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Verdana','sans-serif'"> <o:p></o:p></SPAN></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN class=ecxecx156511519-08122009><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: blue; FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'">So, my
question</SPAN></SPAN><SPAN class=ecxecx968284307-09122009><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: blue; FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'">s</SPAN></SPAN><SPAN
class=ecxecx156511519-08122009><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: blue; FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'">:</SPAN></SPAN><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Verdana','sans-serif'"><o:p></o:p></SPAN></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN class=ecxecx156511519-08122009><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: blue; FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'">Where </SPAN></SPAN><SPAN
class=ecxecx968284307-09122009><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: blue; FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'">are
</SPAN></SPAN><SPAN class=ecxecx156511519-08122009><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: blue; FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'">all the
fixes made such that 'old' versions of the workflows were still functional
even after the upgrade?</SPAN></SPAN><SPAN class=ecxecx968284307-09122009><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: blue; FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'"> Can
they all be made in the 4.6c system, in advance of the
upgrade?</SPAN></SPAN><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Verdana','sans-serif'"><o:p></o:p></SPAN></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN class=ecxecx968284307-09122009><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: blue; FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'">How are
all the fixes made? If they cannot all be made in the 4.6c environment
(e.g. the corrected block-structure issue</SPAN></SPAN><SPAN
class=ecxecx562264707-09122009><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: blue; FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'"> only
manifests in ECC6</SPAN></SPAN><SPAN class=ecxecx968284307-09122009><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: blue; FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'">), how
are new versions avoided?</SPAN></SPAN><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Verdana','sans-serif'"><o:p></o:p></SPAN></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Verdana','sans-serif'"> <o:p></o:p></SPAN></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Verdana','sans-serif'"> <o:p></o:p></SPAN></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN class=ecxecx156511519-08122009><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: blue; FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'">Many
thanks for this information.</SPAN></SPAN><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Verdana','sans-serif'"><o:p></o:p></SPAN></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN class=ecxecx156511519-08122009><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: blue; FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'">Andy</SPAN></SPAN><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Verdana','sans-serif'"><o:p></o:p></SPAN></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Verdana','sans-serif'"> <o:p></o:p></SPAN></P></DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Verdana','sans-serif'"><o:p> </o:p></SPAN></P>
<DIV class=MsoNormal style="TEXT-ALIGN: center" align=center><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Verdana','sans-serif'">
<HR align=center width="100%" SIZE=2>
</SPAN></DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal style="MARGIN-BOTTOM: 12pt"><B><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Tahoma','sans-serif'">From:</SPAN></B><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Tahoma','sans-serif'">
sap-wug-bounces@mit.edu [mailto:sap-wug-bounces@mit.edu] <B>On Behalf Of
</B>Mike Gambier<BR><B>Sent:</B> Thursday 31 July 2008 11:59<BR><B>To:</B> SAP
Workflow Users' Group<BR><B>Subject:</B> RE: Workflow Upgrade issues (4.6c to
ECC 6)</SPAN><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Verdana','sans-serif'"><o:p></o:p></SPAN></P>
<P class=MsoNormal style="MARGIN-BOTTOM: 12pt"><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Verdana','sans-serif'">Hi,<BR> <BR>Just
a follow-up on my earlier post. Feel free to ignore if you're not bothered about
upgrading from 4.x to 700+.<BR> <BR>After a welcome visit from the SAP
Gods of Workflow (Ralf Goetzinger and Peter Amrhein) we now have a couple of
freshly issued OSS Notes to help us along with our quest:<BR> <BR>1.
1234971 - Workflow Builder: Changing the ParForEach expression syntax
(essentially tweaks the SAP Upgrade FM SWD_UPGRADE_3XX_TO_4XX) which should fix
our Multiline binding issues. Yay :)<BR> <BR>2. 1228836 - Compatibility of
conditions with date/time constants (provides an alternative binding solution
for active instances of 'old' definitions at runtime). Does not actually fix
the WF Definition and add the new required {TYPE=...} syntax, but could be
a life-saver during an upgrade if dates and time bindings are used a lot. Also
provides a rather useful ABAP Report utility to scrutinise your WF
Definitions and sniff out date/time bindings (RSWDCLRBUF) which, if you copy and
clone, you can adjust to examine other binding types as well
:)<BR> <BR>Anybody else going through an upgrade should find these two
notes particularly useful.<BR> <BR>These can also be found attached to the
composite Upgrade Note 1068627 which is starting to read a bit like a
bible...<BR> <BR>Ralf and Peter, if you're reading this, thanks
again!<BR> <BR>Regards,<BR> <BR>Mike GT <o:p></o:p></SPAN></P>
<DIV class=MsoNormal style="TEXT-ALIGN: center" align=center><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Verdana','sans-serif'">
<HR align=center width="100%" SIZE=2>
</SPAN></DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal style="MARGIN-BOTTOM: 12pt"><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Verdana','sans-serif'"><BR>Date: Fri, 20
Jun 2008 10:09:04 +1000<BR>From: paul.batey@presenceofit.com.au<BR>To:
sap-wug@mit.edu<BR>Subject: Re: Workflow Upgrade issues (4.6c to ECC
6)<BR><BR><o:p></o:p></SPAN></P>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Verdana','sans-serif'">Hi
Mike,<o:p></o:p></SPAN></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Verdana','sans-serif'"> <o:p></o:p></SPAN></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Verdana','sans-serif'">A client of mine
just went from 46B to ECC6, and we found the following workflow
problems:<o:p></o:p></SPAN></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Verdana','sans-serif'"> <o:p></o:p></SPAN></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Verdana','sans-serif'">1) Every workflow
had to have a block correction done in workflow builder (this may fix your
par for each error). Run SWU7 and if you get loads of invalid node type
errors, a block correction will fix it.<o:p></o:p></SPAN></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Verdana','sans-serif'">2) Old
FORMHTML.PROCESS steps short dumped, so we replaced them with the shiny new form
step.<o:p></o:p></SPAN></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Verdana','sans-serif'">3) Workflow
versions were completely butchered when transported from the first upgraded box
to the next in the sequence. This was fixed by running FM
SWD_WFD_REPLICATE_FROM_9999 and putting the WSXXXXXXXX number into the IM_TASK
field.<o:p></o:p></SPAN></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Verdana','sans-serif'">4) We used
customised versions of RSWUWFML to send email notifications of workitems.
This and any other custom program that put entries into the SOST queue (email,
fax etc) did not properly commit (if memory serves me an SO_OFFICE_SEND
exception 1 error in SOST). A simple explicit COMMIT WORK statement at the
appropriate place in each program sorted that one
out.<o:p></o:p></SPAN></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Verdana','sans-serif'"> <o:p></o:p></SPAN></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Verdana','sans-serif'">Apart from that,
there were minimal issues with workflows starting before the upgrade and
finishing afterwards (unless they hit the short dumping form
step)<BR> <o:p></o:p></SPAN></P></DIV>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN class=ecxecxecgmailquote><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Verdana','sans-serif'">On 6/18/08, <B>Mike
Gambier</B> <<A
href="mailto:madgambler@hotmail.com">madgambler@hotmail.com</A>>
wrote:</SPAN></SPAN><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Verdana','sans-serif'">
<o:p></o:p></SPAN></P>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Verdana','sans-serif'">Gijs,<BR> <BR>We
will have millions of active instances running when we bring the system down to
upgrade it. There's no way we will be able to shut them down and restart,
despite the SAP white paper suggesting that we really should. We have about 100
WF definitions to check...<BR> <BR>Consequently we're having to test how
well they perform in an upgraded environment before we do it for real. Which
means testing lots of areas: triggering events event queued or
otherwise & binding (which works differently in ECC 6), deadlines
(different again in ECC 6), event listeners (which are shifted to a completely
different table), complex alternate bindings, dialog work items being executed
& terminating events, forks, loops, dynamic steps and, of course, general
tRFC/ARFCSSTATE/feedback errors.<BR><BR>Whilst it's always nice to see new OO
stuff coming through as part of the upgrade, the new versions of the Workflow
service jobs are proving to be a bit hard to predict in how they do things. So
we're waiting to see how they cope at volume too.<BR> <BR>By the time we go
live we'll have gone through several full blown upgrade simulations. All of
which means a lot of effort. Hence the pain...<BR> <BR>That and 4 High
Priority OSS Messages already and you can see where I'm coming from. Still, it's
educational and quite fun to dig around in the new
stuff :)<BR> <BR>MGT<o:p></o:p></SPAN></P>
<DIV class=MsoNormal style="TEXT-ALIGN: center" align=center><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Verdana','sans-serif'">
<HR align=center width="100%" SIZE=2>
</SPAN></DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Verdana','sans-serif'">From: <A
href="mailto:gijs@houtzagers.com">gijs@houtzagers.com</A><BR>To: <A
href="mailto:sap-wug@mit.edu">sap-wug@mit.edu</A><BR>Subject: RE: Workflow
Upgrade issues (4.6c to ECC 6)<BR>Date: Tue, 17 Jun 2008 18:46:25 +0200
<o:p></o:p></SPAN></P>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal style="MARGIN-BOTTOM: 12pt"><SPAN
class=ecxecxece><o:p> </o:p></SPAN></P>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'">Hi
Mike,</SPAN><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Verdana','sans-serif'"><BR></SPAN><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'">Could
you elaborate on the painful stuff you were confronted by?</SPAN><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Verdana','sans-serif'"><BR></SPAN><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'">Regards</SPAN><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Verdana','sans-serif'"><BR></SPAN><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'"> </SPAN><o:p></o:p></P>
<DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'">Gijs
Houtzagers</SPAN><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Verdana','sans-serif'"><BR></SPAN><I><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'">Principal
Consultant</SPAN></I><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Verdana','sans-serif'"><BR></SPAN><B><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'"> </SPAN></B><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Verdana','sans-serif'"><BR></SPAN><B><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'">Kirkman</SPAN></B><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'"> Company
B.V.</SPAN><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Verdana','sans-serif'"><BR></SPAN><SPAN
lang=NL
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'">Amsterdamsestraatweg
40</SPAN><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Verdana','sans-serif'"><BR></SPAN><SPAN
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lang=NL
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: 'Verdana','sans-serif'"> </SPAN><SPAN
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lang=NL
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'">T</SPAN></B><SPAN
lang=NL style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'">
+31 (0)88 40 40 400</SPAN><SPAN
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lang=EN-GB
style="FONT-SIZE: 8pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'">------------------------------------------------------</SPAN><SPAN
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<P class=MsoNormal><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; COLOR: navy; FONT-FAMILY: 'Arial','sans-serif'"> </SPAN><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Verdana','sans-serif'"><o:p></o:p></SPAN></P>
<DIV>
<DIV class=MsoNormal style="TEXT-ALIGN: center" align=center>
<HR align=center width="100%" SIZE=2>
</DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal><B><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Tahoma','sans-serif'">From:</SPAN></B><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Tahoma','sans-serif'"> <A
href="mailto:sap-wug-bounces@mit.edu">sap-wug-bounces@mit.edu</A> [mailto:<A
href="mailto:sap-wug-bounces@mit.edu">sap-wug-bounces@mit.edu</A>] <B>On Behalf
Of </B>Mike Gambier<BR><B>Sent:</B> dinsdag 17 juni 2008 17:12<BR><B>To:</B> SAP
Workflow Users' Group<BR><B>Subject:</B> Workflow Upgrade issues (4.6c to ECC
6)</SPAN><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Verdana','sans-serif'"><o:p></o:p></SPAN></P></DIV>
<P class=MsoNormal> <SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Verdana','sans-serif'"><o:p></o:p></SPAN></P>
<P class=MsoNormal style="MARGIN-BOTTOM: 12pt"><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Tahoma','sans-serif'">Hi,<BR> <BR>We're
currently struggling through a rather painful upgrade process from 4.6c to ECC 6
and we've hit a few Workflow mines.<BR> <BR>Despite several high priority
OSS Messages the end result from SAP so far as been a fairly poor
acknowledgement of issues that need to be addressed manually, culminating in OSS
Note 1175535.<BR><BR>Basically we have 4 known faults at the moment. Two
relating to changes not coming across from 4.6c into ECC 6 based around Workflow
Container Elements and Event Linkages, which I can quite understand as the
target tables ahve shifted in ECC 6. But the other two point to problems in
SAP's 'mapping' process where they convert 4.6c (or older) definitions into ECC
6 syntax (Kernel 700+).<BR> <BR>These issues are:<BR> <BR>1. Multiline
Table handling - to use these properly in loops and dynamic steps it seems you
now have to use a new &WF_PARFOREACH_INDEX& element that only becomes
available after 4.6c<BR> <BR>They did suggest trying a dodgy binding switch
as implemented by OSS Message 1083317, which mostly works for active
instances but only as long as the 'Change Release' value on the WF version
remains equal to or lower than '46C'. Not all that useful if the instances are
on the current active version and that definition is then activated in the ECC 6
environment. But that doesn't actually fix the definition syntax going forward
anyway.<BR> <BR>2. Condition binding after 4.6c introduces a {TYPE=...}
additional statement in SWDSCONDEF so that, for example, a hard-coded
string like '31.12.9999' can be converted into a date variable at runtime to
compare against an object date property. Prior to 4.6c this statement did not
exist. Now it is required or else the binding is considered to be erroneous and
a syntax error will result.<BR> <BR>Has anyone esle come across
upgrade-related issues other than these?<BR> <BR>Regards,<BR> <BR>Mike
GT<BR> </SPAN><SPAN
style="FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: 'Verdana','sans-serif'"><o:p></o:p></SPAN></P>
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