From jasonk at MIT.EDU  Thu Jan  3 13:01:37 2008
From: jasonk at MIT.EDU (Jason Kelly)
Date: Thu, 3 Jan 2008 13:01:37 -0500
Subject: [OWW-SC] SC Meeting Next TH (1/10) @ Noon EST
Message-ID: <7c085c480801031001k77bafe27lcde215d771335cd5@mail.gmail.com>

Happy New Year SC!

Apologies for confusion, but the SC meeting was pushed to next TH
(1/10) due to the holidays, it will be at Noon EST as usual.

Chairs fill in your reports here:
http://openwetware.org/wiki/OpenWetWare:Steering_committee/Meeting_-_January_2008

Please add items to the agenda:
http://openwetware.org/wiki/OpenWetWare:Steering_committee_next_meeting

Or take a look at action list from last month for left over to-do items.
http://openwetware.org/wiki/OpenWetWare:Steering_committee_actions

Number is 617-452-5208, and austin can send out details for people using sip.

Thanks!
jason


From endy at MIT.EDU  Fri Jan  4 10:56:41 2008
From: endy at MIT.EDU (Drew Endy)
Date: Fri, 4 Jan 2008 10:56:41 -0500
Subject: [OWW-SC] POWW!
Message-ID: <FBA4E68D-F632-4B03-BA7E-06F5CC02AB37@mit.edu>

Does anybody want to start a new peer-reviewed Wiki-based journal?

POWW (Proceedings of the Open Wet Ware)

Thoughts?

Happy 2008!


From johncumbers at gmail.com  Fri Jan  4 11:31:32 2008
From: johncumbers at gmail.com (John Cumbers)
Date: Fri, 4 Jan 2008 11:31:32 -0500
Subject: [OWW-SC] POWW!
In-Reply-To: <FBA4E68D-F632-4B03-BA7E-06F5CC02AB37@mit.edu>
References: <FBA4E68D-F632-4B03-BA7E-06F5CC02AB37@mit.edu>
Message-ID: <cfd758050801040831u53cf8197ra42fb62b6f7fc060@mail.gmail.com>

Yes, I'm interested in this, but I think that we can do better than a
traditional wiki.  The majority of people still print pdf's if they want to
read and study something in detail, mainly because viewing PDF's on screen
sucks, viewing wiki pages is somewhat better and the PLOS on-line format is
good, but I think we're missing the main point.

We need a way to replicate the things that we like about reading things on
paper, in a digital way so that people wanting to study the content, want to
read it on-line instead of printing it.   I have some ideas for tracking the
published content, hiding the details unless you want to see them, timing
how long it takes people to read things and how they move through the
content.  How might this be done? I have some other ideas for a dev house
(via Mac Cowell), a weekend(ish) codathon or competition that oww could
sponsor to develop some of this software.   E.g give the coders a
traditional published paper, ask them to dissect it and re-publish it in a
form most easily readable on-line, then have a bank of naive testers to see
which format is the easiest/fastest to comprehend.

Perhaps the main article could be a traditional wiki page, but tagged so
that the content could be scrapped into the different forms?

I was really busy last semester, but I have some more time now.   I can pen
down some more detailed ideas, but any thoughts on this so far?

cheers,
John



On Jan 4, 2008 10:56 AM, Drew Endy <endy at mit.edu> wrote:

> Does anybody want to start a new peer-reviewed Wiki-based journal?
>
> POWW (Proceedings of the Open Wet Ware)
>
> Thoughts?
>
> Happy 2008!
> _______________________________________________
> OpenWetWare Steering Committee Mailing List
> sc at openwetware.org
> http://mailman.mit.edu/mailman/listinfo/oww-sc
>



-- 
John Cumbers,  Graduate Student
Biology and Medicine
Brown University, Box G-W
Providence, Rhode Island, 02912, USA
Tel USA: +1 401 523 8190,  Fax: +1 401 863-2166
UK to USA: 0207 617 7824
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From austin at csail.mit.edu  Fri Jan  4 12:52:31 2008
From: austin at csail.mit.edu (Austin Che)
Date: Fri, 04 Jan 2008 12:52:31 -0500
Subject: [OWW-SC] POWW!
In-Reply-To: <cfd758050801040831u53cf8197ra42fb62b6f7fc060@mail.gmail.com>
	(John Cumbers's message of "Fri, 4 Jan 2008 11:31:32 -0500")
References: <FBA4E68D-F632-4B03-BA7E-06F5CC02AB37@mit.edu>
	<cfd758050801040831u53cf8197ra42fb62b6f7fc060@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <878x35o4v4.fsf@nitsua.mit.edu>


> read and study something in detail, mainly because viewing PDF's on screen
> sucks, viewing wiki pages is somewhat better and the PLOS on-line format is
> good, but I think we're missing the main point.

    I actually think PDFs online are easier to read than wikis.
    
> We need a way to replicate the things that we like about reading things on
> paper, in a digital way so that people wanting to study the content, want to
> read it on-line instead of printing it.   I have some ideas for tracking the

    This a good idea but I think is quite separate from the idea of a
    POWW journal. We don't need a journal to do any of these things.
    
> Perhaps the main article could be a traditional wiki page, but tagged so
> that the content could be scrapped into the different forms?

    plos has a xml format for their content. If we just wanted to work
    on the easy online reading of content, we could begin by creating
    a front-end for plos content and displaying their articles in a
    friendly way.
    
    I think a POWW journal has more possibilities in actually changing
    the way the publishing process works rather than just the final
    form of the content.
    
    Some ideas:
    - All peer reviews are public, on the wiki, and reviewers get
    credit
    - A better credit, authorship system at least for who wrote an
    article on the wiki. If I see an interesting fact/sentence in an
    article, I should be able to easily figure out who wrote that and
    should contact to get more info.
    - Continually evolving articles
    - Article comments/discussions being tracked with an article
    - Of course, openness in everything
    
-- 
Austin Che           <austin at csail.mit.edu>          (617)253-5899


From johncumbers at gmail.com  Fri Jan  4 13:10:36 2008
From: johncumbers at gmail.com (John Cumbers)
Date: Fri, 4 Jan 2008 13:10:36 -0500
Subject: [OWW-SC] POWW!
In-Reply-To: <878x35o4v4.fsf@nitsua.mit.edu>
References: <FBA4E68D-F632-4B03-BA7E-06F5CC02AB37@mit.edu>
	<cfd758050801040831u53cf8197ra42fb62b6f7fc060@mail.gmail.com>
	<878x35o4v4.fsf@nitsua.mit.edu>
Message-ID: <cfd758050801041010h415bb7dna1a394120c3b7c88@mail.gmail.com>

I agree, perhaps separating the content management idea, trying it out on
PLOS content first sounds like a better idea,
some good ideas,
John

On Jan 4, 2008 12:52 PM, Austin Che <austin at csail.mit.edu> wrote:

>
> > read and study something in detail, mainly because viewing PDF's on
> screen
> > sucks, viewing wiki pages is somewhat better and the PLOS on-line format
> is
> > good, but I think we're missing the main point.
>
>    I actually think PDFs online are easier to read than wikis.
>
> > We need a way to replicate the things that we like about reading things
> on
> > paper, in a digital way so that people wanting to study the content,
> want to
> > read it on-line instead of printing it.   I have some ideas for tracking
> the
>
>    This a good idea but I think is quite separate from the idea of a
>    POWW journal. We don't need a journal to do any of these things.
>
> > Perhaps the main article could be a traditional wiki page, but tagged so
> > that the content could be scrapped into the different forms?
>
>    plos has a xml format for their content. If we just wanted to work
>    on the easy online reading of content, we could begin by creating
>    a front-end for plos content and displaying their articles in a
>    friendly way.
>
>    I think a POWW journal has more possibilities in actually changing
>    the way the publishing process works rather than just the final
>    form of the content.
>
>    Some ideas:
>    - All peer reviews are public, on the wiki, and reviewers get
>    credit
>    - A better credit, authorship system at least for who wrote an
>    article on the wiki. If I see an interesting fact/sentence in an
>    article, I should be able to easily figure out who wrote that and
>    should contact to get more info.
>    - Continually evolving articles
>    - Article comments/discussions being tracked with an article
>    - Of course, openness in everything
>
> --
> Austin Che           <austin at csail.mit.edu>          (617)253-5899
> _______________________________________________
> OpenWetWare Steering Committee Mailing List
> sc at openwetware.org
> http://mailman.mit.edu/mailman/listinfo/oww-sc
>



-- 
John Cumbers,  Graduate Student
Biology and Medicine
Brown University, Box G-W
Providence, Rhode Island, 02912, USA
Tel USA: +1 401 523 8190,  Fax: +1 401 863-2166
UK to USA: 0207 617 7824
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From johncumbers at gmail.com  Fri Jan  4 18:31:46 2008
From: johncumbers at gmail.com (John Cumbers)
Date: Fri, 4 Jan 2008 18:31:46 -0500
Subject: [OWW-SC] POWW!
In-Reply-To: <cfd758050801041010h415bb7dna1a394120c3b7c88@mail.gmail.com>
References: <FBA4E68D-F632-4B03-BA7E-06F5CC02AB37@mit.edu>
	<cfd758050801040831u53cf8197ra42fb62b6f7fc060@mail.gmail.com>
	<878x35o4v4.fsf@nitsua.mit.edu>
	<cfd758050801041010h415bb7dna1a394120c3b7c88@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <cfd758050801041531s602c965bi63207e8af914aa66@mail.gmail.com>

speaking of those who like PDF's...

WikiEducator is a wiki for e-learning material, this extension allows you to
click a button to add things to your 'PDF shopping cart' as you go along,
finally you check out and print all the things you put in there as a single
PDF, could be a useful feature for POWW, still in beta,

from: http://wikieducator.org/Help:Collections
cheers,
John


WikiEducator is currently testing a new feature for managing collections of
wiki pages. The *Collection Manager*, shown in the WikiEducator sidebar,
allows any user to build selections of wiki content, and to export them as a
PDF file.

With this new feature you can:

   - add or remove pages from a collection;
   - generate and download a PDF file from your current collection;
   - Produce a PDF from a single page; or
   - save your page collections for later use or to share them with your
   friends.

The feature is still experimental, and may not work on some pages, typically
those containing large amounts of custom HTML.

*If you notice pages that do not work, please help us by adding them to our Bug
report <http://wikieducator.org/Help:Collections/Bug_reports>.*


*
*


On Jan 4, 2008 1:10 PM, John Cumbers <johncumbers at gmail.com> wrote:

> I agree, perhaps separating the content management idea, trying it out on
> PLOS content first sounds like a better idea,
> some good ideas,
> John
>
>
> On Jan 4, 2008 12:52 PM, Austin Che < austin at csail.mit.edu> wrote:
>
> >
> > > read and study something in detail, mainly because viewing PDF's on
> > screen
> > > sucks, viewing wiki pages is somewhat better and the PLOS on-line
> > format is
> > > good, but I think we're missing the main point.
> >
> >    I actually think PDFs online are easier to read than wikis.
> >
> > > We need a way to replicate the things that we like about reading
> > things on
> > > paper, in a digital way so that people wanting to study the content,
> > want to
> > > read it on-line instead of printing it.   I have some ideas for
> > tracking the
> >
> >    This a good idea but I think is quite separate from the idea of a
> >    POWW journal. We don't need a journal to do any of these things.
> >
> > > Perhaps the main article could be a traditional wiki page, but tagged
> > so
> > > that the content could be scrapped into the different forms?
> >
> >    plos has a xml format for their content. If we just wanted to work
> >    on the easy online reading of content, we could begin by creating
> >    a front-end for plos content and displaying their articles in a
> >    friendly way.
> >
> >    I think a POWW journal has more possibilities in actually changing
> >    the way the publishing process works rather than just the final
> >    form of the content.
> >
> >    Some ideas:
> >    - All peer reviews are public, on the wiki, and reviewers get
> >    credit
> >    - A better credit, authorship system at least for who wrote an
> >    article on the wiki. If I see an interesting fact/sentence in an
> >    article, I should be able to easily figure out who wrote that and
> >    should contact to get more info.
> >    - Continually evolving articles
> >    - Article comments/discussions being tracked with an article
> >    - Of course, openness in everything
> >
> > --
> > Austin Che           <austin at csail.mit.edu >          (617)253-5899
> > _______________________________________________
> > OpenWetWare Steering Committee Mailing List
> > sc at openwetware.org
> > http://mailman.mit.edu/mailman/listinfo/oww-sc
> >
>
>
>
> --
> John Cumbers,  Graduate Student
> Biology and Medicine
> Brown University, Box G-W
> Providence, Rhode Island, 02912, USA
> Tel USA: +1 401 523 8190,  Fax: +1 401 863-2166
> UK to USA: 0207 617 7824
>



-- 
John Cumbers,  Graduate Student
Biology and Medicine
Brown University, Box G-W
Providence, Rhode Island, 02912, USA
Tel USA: +1 401 523 8190,  Fax: +1 401 863-2166
UK to USA: 0207 617 7824
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From austin at csail.mit.edu  Fri Jan  4 21:14:37 2008
From: austin at csail.mit.edu (Austin Che)
Date: Fri, 04 Jan 2008 21:14:37 -0500
Subject: [OWW-SC] POWW!
In-Reply-To: <cfd758050801041531s602c965bi63207e8af914aa66@mail.gmail.com>
	(John Cumbers's message of "Fri, 4 Jan 2008 18:31:46 -0500")
References: <FBA4E68D-F632-4B03-BA7E-06F5CC02AB37@mit.edu>
	<cfd758050801040831u53cf8197ra42fb62b6f7fc060@mail.gmail.com>
	<878x35o4v4.fsf@nitsua.mit.edu>
	<cfd758050801041010h415bb7dna1a394120c3b7c88@mail.gmail.com>
	<cfd758050801041531s602c965bi63207e8af914aa66@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <87lk75j9wy.fsf@nitsua.mit.edu>


> WikiEducator is a wiki for e-learning material, this extension allows you to
> click a button to add things to your 'PDF shopping cart' as you go along,
> finally you check out and print all the things you put in there as a single
> PDF, could be a useful feature for POWW, still in beta,
>
> from: http://wikieducator.org/Help:Collections

    Forget about POWW, this is a useful feature for OWW now! Printing
    wiki pages is so ugly. Their generated pdf actually looks nice. I
    think there would be great demand for a wiki page to nice looking
    pdf extension immediately.
    
-- 
Austin Che           <austin at csail.mit.edu>          (617)253-5899


From austin at csail.mit.edu  Fri Jan  4 21:12:24 2008
From: austin at csail.mit.edu (Austin Che)
Date: Fri, 04 Jan 2008 21:12:24 -0500
Subject: [OWW-SC] POWW!
In-Reply-To: <009c01c84f24$c32f67e0$498e37a0$@edu> (Steven J. Koch's message
	of "Fri, 4 Jan 2008 15:54:27 -0700")
References: <FBA4E68D-F632-4B03-BA7E-06F5CC02AB37@mit.edu>
	<cfd758050801040831u53cf8197ra42fb62b6f7fc060@mail.gmail.com>
	<878x35o4v4.fsf@nitsua.mit.edu> <009c01c84f24$c32f67e0$498e37a0$@edu>
Message-ID: <87r6gxja0n.fsf@nitsua.mit.edu>


> I didn't want to cloud the OWW-SC discussion about POWW, but did want to let
> you know that I wholeheartedly support your idea of completely public    
> refereeing.  I think it would have many positives (such as you mention
> credit for referee's work and I also think it would increase the quality of
> first submissions and referee diligence) and I can't think of any negatives
> that aren't bogus or counter-productive to progress anyway.
>
> Have you seen or do you know anything about this site:
> http://academia.wikia.com/wiki/Main_Page ?  It looks like it is dead or
> dying, but there would be good ideas if you decide to try out POWW.  For
> example, here:
> http://academia.wikia.com/wiki/Biology_Journal:Instructions_for_authors 

    Steve,    
    
    I don't think you should be afraid to spam the steering committee
    list.

    Anyway, that site looks extremely interesting. It seems like they
    have the exact same idea of a wiki journal. Someone should follow
    up with them.

-- 
Austin Che           <austin at csail.mit.edu>          (617)253-5899


From endy at MIT.EDU  Sat Jan  5 10:09:02 2008
From: endy at MIT.EDU (Drew Endy)
Date: Sat, 5 Jan 2008 10:09:02 -0500
Subject: [OWW-SC] POWW!
In-Reply-To: <477F2435.1080800@gmail.com>
References: <FBA4E68D-F632-4B03-BA7E-06F5CC02AB37@mit.edu>
	<477F2435.1080800@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <D477C572-4BED-482D-8F3C-1E828F4F1CFD@mit.edu>

I think an important thing to start with is the remove the  
"transaction costs" associated with submitting, revising, and proofing  
a manuscript.  This takes way too much time at present, even for the  
most enlightened and wealthy journals.  A wiki-based (or better)  
platform could almost completely remove these costs.



On Jan 5, 2008, at 1:31 AM, Lon Chubiz wrote:

> An interesting feature might be to have an effective mechanism to  
> request strains, plasmids, code, etc. from the authors. Maybe as  
> part of the materials and methods users/readers could add these  
> things like items to a "shopping cart" or something which would send  
> a request for them. I haven't seen anything like that before with a  
> journal. Perhaps, that could factor into some of the updated content  
> ideas others have mentioned. Send stuff out and add in responses on  
> how your stuff works in other hands.
>
> Lon
>
> Drew Endy wrote:
>> Does anybody want to start a new peer-reviewed Wiki-based journal?
>>
>> POWW (Proceedings of the Open Wet Ware)
>>
>> Thoughts?
>>
>> Happy 2008!
>> _______________________________________________
>> OpenWetWare Steering Committee Mailing List
>> sc at openwetware.org
>> http://mailman.mit.edu/mailman/listinfo/oww-sc
>>
>



From bill.altmail at gmail.com  Mon Jan  7 12:11:29 2008
From: bill.altmail at gmail.com (Bill F)
Date: Mon, 7 Jan 2008 12:11:29 -0500
Subject: [OWW-SC] FYI: Wikia Search Engine Goes Live Today
Message-ID: <26428aaa0801070911g253020dew820199d4752e0dae@mail.gmail.com>

<comment>

FYI: I wanted to pass this along. article along.

This new search engine is still not here for OWW but I'll find out how it
will be released and pass on what I find. Hopefully the search engine will
become part of Wikipedia or at least available as an Open Source project we
can use for OWW.

>From the sound of it, every search is generating a new article. This means
that results from search can be treated just like other docs. In a way, the
equivalent of an RSS document is manufactured whenever a search is
performed. This is speculation on my part. I'll get a handle on it.

</comment>



Wikia Search Engine Goes Live Today Search Wikia, the widely awaited search
engine from Wikipedia founder Jimmy Wales, is slated to make its official
debut today. Juan Carlos Perez, IDG News Service
http://www.pcworld.com/article/id,141087-c,searchengines/article.html

Monday, January 07, 2008 6:00 AM PST
 <http://www.pcworld.com/printable/article/id,141087/printable.html><http://www.pcworld.com/emailfriend?aid=141087><javascript:void(0);><http://www.pcworld.com/resource/rss.html>
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Today'))><javascript:bookmarkPop('http://digg.com/submit?phase=2&url='+encodeURIComponent('http://www.pcworld.com/article/id,141087/article.html')+'&title='+encodeURIComponent('Wikia
Search Engine Goes Live Today')+'&bodytext='+encodeURIComponent('Search
Wikia, the widely awaited search engine from Wikipedia founder Jimmy Wales,
is slated to make its official debut
today.'))><javascript:bookmarkPop('http://del.icio.us/post?url='+encodeURIComponent('http://www.pcworld.com/article/id,141087/article.html')+'&title='+encodeURIComponent('Wikia
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Search Engine Goes Live Today'))>
 Recommend this story?
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 Please Wait...

Search Wikia <http://www.wikia.com/>, the widely awaited search engine from
Wikipedia <http://www.pcworld.com/tags/Wikimedia+Foundation+Inc..html>founder
Jimmy Wales, is slated to make its official debut on Monday, with
the bet that an open-source, community-driven effort can disrupt and reshape
this Google <http://www.pcworld.com/tags/Google+Inc..html>-dominated market.

However, people who give the search engine a test drive on Monday shouldn't
expect a Google killer, because they will be looking at a project that is at
a very early stage and will need participation from volunteers to grow and
be refined, Wales said.

In that sense, Search Wikia is expected to develop in a similar fashion to
Wikipedia, an online encyclopedia written and edited by a community of
volunteer collaborators who have expanded it and improved it organically
over the years.

"Search Wikia is an extremely alpha project. It's a project to build a
search engine and not a full-fledged competitor to Google yet. We want to
make sure people understand that it's in its very early days," Wales said.

Still, Wales fully expects Search Wikia to eventually be a better
alternative to commercial search engines from the likes of Google,
Yahoo<http://www.pcworld.com/tags/Yahoo%21+Inc..html>,
Microsoft <http://www.pcworld.com/tags/Microsoft+Corporation.html>,
AOL<http://www.pcworld.com/tags/AOL+LLC.html>and
Ask.com <http://www.pcworld.com/tags/Ask.com.html>.

"I don't know how long it will take to reach industry-standard quality
search results, but I'd say at least two years," he said.
Volunteer

People interested in volunteering will find a variety of options at Search
Wikia, including working with the software to improve and extend it, as well
as suggesting pages for the index and evaluating and rating search results.

Those who register to participate in the project will join a social
networking environment where they can have a list of friends, upload photos,
build profiles and be notified of friends' actions.

Users of the search engine will be presented with what Wales calls a "mini
article" at the top of the results list. This can be a photo, a text
definition, an external link or whatever else has been determined is the
best answer to that particular query.

Below the "mini article" will be the list of results, picked from the Search
Wikia index, which on Monday will have anywhere between 50 million and 100
million Web pages. Wales concedes that number is small, but said it will
continue to grow over time.

Users will be able to rank the quality of individual search results, and
Search Wikia will factor in that feedback when solving future queries. "That
way, people will be able to influence the algorithmic search results," he
said.

Those who try to abuse the system for, say, search engine spamming purposes,
are bound to be quickly noticed by administrators and other community
members, and they will swiftly be blocked and banned, Wales said.
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From rshetty at MIT.EDU  Mon Jan  7 18:02:50 2008
From: rshetty at MIT.EDU (Reshma Shetty)
Date: Mon, 7 Jan 2008 18:02:50 -0500
Subject: [OWW-SC] welcome to OpenWetWare's new managing director Lorrie
	LeJeune
Message-ID: <6e9f40380801071502u7014bcecg22bc7ec1b75fbead@mail.gmail.com>

Hello,

As most of you know if you've looked at the OpenWetWare homepage or
called in to recent steering committee meetings, we've had a search
open for a second full-time member of OpenWetWare team.  After
launching a new search for an OpenWetWare managing director in the
last few months, we've extended an offer to Lorrie LeJeune.  And we
are excited to say that she has accepted.

Lorrie will bring a diverse set of skills to OpenWetWare.  Most
notably, she's worked previously both as a laboratory research
scientist at Collaborative Research, Inc. (now Oscient
Pharmaceuticals, Inc.) and as an editor at O'Reilly Media, Inc. for
all of O'Reilly's bioinformatics books.  She even drew the artwork on
some of the O'Reilly covers!  Lorrie will officially begin work
full-time at OpenWetWare on February 4.

Many of you had an opportunity to speak with Lorrie at a previous
steering committee meeting.  You'll all have a chance to speak again
with Lorrie at the upcoming steering committee meeting on Thursday.

Please join me in welcoming Lorrie to the OpenWetWare community!

Thanks,

Reshma
on behalf of the OpenWetWare Board


From jasonk at MIT.EDU  Wed Jan  9 16:15:28 2008
From: jasonk at MIT.EDU (Jason Kelly)
Date: Wed, 9 Jan 2008 16:15:28 -0500
Subject: [OWW-SC] Fwd: The Scientific American "Science 2.0" story is
	finally online!
In-Reply-To: <c7bc3be20801091238x6f68d662y106eeae3ca475623@mail.gmail.com>
References: <c7bc3be20801091238x6f68d662y106eeae3ca475623@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <7c085c480801091315g243ffd3dw45e36cb5865a908f@mail.gmail.com>

Hi SC,

OpenWetWare is featured in a Scientific American story this month.
They are experimenting with getting reader feedback on the web prior
to publishing the print edition -- with the intent of including some
of the feedback to improve the article before press.

So please share your experiences of doing open science on OWW here:
http://www.sciam.com/article.cfm?id=science-2-point-0-great-new-tool-or-great-risk

See the author's (Mitch Waldrop) comments below.

Also, reminder that the SC meeting is tomorrow at Noon EST.  Chairs,
please post notes here:
http://openwetware.org/wiki/OpenWetWare:Steering_committee/Meeting_-_January_2008

Talk to you tomorrow, thanks,
jason

---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: M. Mitchell Waldrop <mmwaldrop at gmail.com>
Date: Jan 9, 2008 3:38 PM
Subject: The Scientific American "Science 2.0" story is finally online!

Dear Everyone--

With my heartfelt thanks for all your help, and with my equally
heartfelt apologies for the length of time it has taken, I'm writing
to tell you that Scientific American has finally posted the Science
2.0 story on its Web site. The link is here:
http://www.sciam.com/article.cfm?id=science-2-point-0-great-new-tool-or-great-risk
. As the introduction explains, this is actually an experiment in
getting reader feedback well before the print version appears. So I
hope you will all take advantage of that opportunity. And I hope you
will also publicize the link as widely as you can--on your blogs,
wikis and websites, among your fellow workshop and FOOcamp attendees,
wherever. Let's make the experiment a success!


For your convenience, here is the Web posting introduction:



Welcome to a Scientific American experiment in "networked journalism,"
in which readers?you?get to collaborate with the author to give a
story its final form.

The article, below, is a particularly apt candidate for such an
experiment: it's my feature story on "Science 2.0," which describes
how researchers are beginning to harness wikis, blogs and other Web
2.0 technologies as a potentially transformative way of doing science.
The draft article appears here, several months in advance of its print
publication, and we are inviting you to comment on it. Your inputs
will influence the article's content, reporting, perhaps even its
point of view.

So consider yourself invited. Please share your thoughts about the
promise and peril of Science 2.0.?just post your inputs in the Comment
section below. To help get you started, here are some questions to
mull over:
What do you think of the article itself? Are there errors?
Oversimplifications? Gaps?
What do you think of the notion of "Science 2.0?" Will Web 2.0 tools
really make science much more productive? Will wikis, blogs and the
like be transformative, or will they be just a minor convenience?
Science 2.0 is one aspect of a broader Open Science movement, which
also includes Open-Access scientific publishing and Open Data
practices. How do you think this bigger movement will evolve?
Looking at your own scientific field, how real is the suspicion and
mistrust mentioned in the article? How much do you and your colleagues
worry about getting "scooped"? Do you have first-hand knowledge of a
case in which that has actually happened?
When young scientists speak out on an open blog or wiki, do they risk
hurting their careers?
Is "open notebook" science always a good idea? Are there certain
aspects of a project that researchers should keep quite, at least
until the paper is published?

--M. Mitchell Waldrop



-- 
M. Mitchell Waldrop
2430 39th Street NW
Washington, DC  20007
202-337-9105 (W)
202-744-1792 (M)
mmwaldrop at gmail.com
http://mmwaldrop.com/Starclouds



From austin at csail.mit.edu  Wed Jan  9 23:13:38 2008
From: austin at csail.mit.edu (Austin Che)
Date: Wed, 09 Jan 2008 23:13:38 -0500
Subject: [OWW-SC] Fwd: The Scientific American "Science 2.0" story is
	finally online!
In-Reply-To: <7c085c480801091315g243ffd3dw45e36cb5865a908f@mail.gmail.com>
	(Jason Kelly's message of "Wed, 9 Jan 2008 16:15:28 -0500")
References: <c7bc3be20801091238x6f68d662y106eeae3ca475623@mail.gmail.com>
	<7c085c480801091315g243ffd3dw45e36cb5865a908f@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <87tzlmco7h.fsf@nitsua.mit.edu>


> OpenWetWare is featured in a Scientific American story this month.
> They are experimenting with getting reader feedback on the web prior
> to publishing the print edition -- with the intent of including some
> of the feedback to improve the article before press.

    Where did this come from:
    "By default, OpenWetWare pages are visible to anyone (although
    researchers have the option to make pages private.)"

-- 
Austin Che           <austin at csail.mit.edu>          (617)253-5899


From jasonk at MIT.EDU  Wed Jan  9 23:43:29 2008
From: jasonk at MIT.EDU (Jason Kelly)
Date: Wed, 9 Jan 2008 23:43:29 -0500
Subject: [OWW-SC] Fwd: The Scientific American "Science 2.0" story is
	finally online!
In-Reply-To: <87tzlmco7h.fsf@nitsua.mit.edu>
References: <c7bc3be20801091238x6f68d662y106eeae3ca475623@mail.gmail.com>
	<7c085c480801091315g243ffd3dw45e36cb5865a908f@mail.gmail.com>
	<87tzlmco7h.fsf@nitsua.mit.edu>
Message-ID: <7c085c480801092043l21a5b115va16bffd8effca54c@mail.gmail.com>

Sounds like a misinterpretation -- correct it in the comments! ;)

jason

On Jan 9, 2008 11:13 PM, Austin Che <austin at csail.mit.edu> wrote:
>
> > OpenWetWare is featured in a Scientific American story this month.
> > They are experimenting with getting reader feedback on the web prior
> > to publishing the print edition -- with the intent of including some
> > of the feedback to improve the article before press.
>
>     Where did this come from:
>     "By default, OpenWetWare pages are visible to anyone (although
>     researchers have the option to make pages private.)"
>
> --
> Austin Che           <austin at csail.mit.edu>          (617)253-5899
>
> _______________________________________________
> OpenWetWare Steering Committee Mailing List
> sc at openwetware.org
> http://mailman.mit.edu/mailman/listinfo/oww-sc
>


From jasonk at MIT.EDU  Fri Jan 11 11:49:16 2008
From: jasonk at MIT.EDU (Jason Kelly)
Date: Fri, 11 Jan 2008 11:49:16 -0500
Subject: [OWW-SC] January 08 SC Meeting Notes
Message-ID: <7c085c480801110849t6cdf0808s5ba105d580925a05@mail.gmail.com>

Hi SC,

Thanks everyone for calling in to the meeting, great discussion I thought.

For those who couldn't make it, notes are here:
http://openwetware.org/wiki/OpenWetWare:Steering_committee/Meeting_-_January_2008

action list here:
http://openwetware.org/wiki/OpenWetWare:Steering_committee_actions

We're going to be having a couple meetings between now and the next SC
meeting.  John and Julius are putting together a discussion about
publishing / POWW / ArXiv / etc and Bill will be leading a tutorial of
the new lab notebook software.

Should be an exciting month!

thanks,
jason


From tk at csail.mit.edu  Mon Jan 14 17:04:12 2008
From: tk at csail.mit.edu (Tom Knight)
Date: Mon, 14 Jan 2008 17:04:12 -0500
Subject: [OWW-SC] NIH open access policy
Message-ID: <37bb0967c9dd1e4b3d964375304045a6@csail.mit.edu>

NIH Adds Details to New Public Access PubMed Policy

By a GenomeWeb staff reporter

NEW YORK (GenomeWeb News) ? The National Institutes of Health has 
fleshed out the details of its newly adopted open access policy, which 
mandates that all NIH-funded investigators must submit an electronic 
version of their final, peer-reviewed manuscripts to PubMed Central 
within 12 months after official publication, through a?policy statement 
and a FAQ page on the NIH?s Public Access website.
?
The mandate, which became law through the end-of-year passage of the 
omnibus spending bill that also funded the NIH for 2008, will apply to 
articles from investigators funded in whole or in part by the NIH, and 
if NIH pays the investigator?s salary. The submissions will include all 
graphics and supplemental materials.
?
NIH will help pay for publication in open access journals through its 
grant funding, so long as the author?s agreement with the journal is in 
accordance with the NIH?s open access policy.
?
The rule will take effect for investigators funded under an NIH grant 
cooperative agreement in fiscal year 2008, or those funded under NIH 
contracts signed on or after April 7, and will cover those applications 
submitted to the NIH by this year?s May 25 due date.
?
Investigators in future applications must include the PubMed Central 
reference number when they cite their own NIH-funded articles.
?
Investigators publishing in journals that already submit their articles 
to PubMed do not need to submit their articles separately.
?
NIH estimates that its funding backs the research behind as many as 
80,000 articles each year.
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From bill.altmail at gmail.com  Mon Jan 14 20:21:29 2008
From: bill.altmail at gmail.com (Bill F)
Date: Mon, 14 Jan 2008 20:21:29 -0500
Subject: [OWW-SC] OWW Lab Notebook: very preliminary preview
Message-ID: <26428aaa0801141721q70976c09oe3fbce5a97c5b43c@mail.gmail.com>

The OWW Lab Notebook is available for your investigation on the main wiki.

You must be logged in to use the Lab Notebook.

To enable OWW Lab Notebook for your OWW account, simply go to the "my
preferences" page (http://openwetware.org/wiki/Special:Preferences) and
select the "Misc" tab at the far right.

The OWW Lab Notebook pages are not populated until you enable it for your
account. However, if you choose to turn off the Lab Notebook features, an
data you have collected will remain intact. There is never a place where we
will be deleting data. This is an absolutely cardinal rule. As you may know,
the MediaWiki application creates a new copy of any document as soon as a
change is saved to the database. We are doing nothing to interfere with this
absolutely critical feature of MediaWiki.

Clicking on the "Enable Lab Notebook" checkbox and saving the new value
will  make it accessible.

Once it's enables, you should see a new "My Lab Notebook" link added to the
end of the list of entries in the top right hand corner of your screen.

Click on the "My Lab Notebook" link to access the Lab Notebook.

Please note: this is not all there yet There's still more to come.

Later tonight (1/14/2008), I'll turn on the page reformatting feature. I
have a few more tests to run and this feature will be enabled.

I also need to finish a few changes that will allow each user to optionally
control the format of all of the pages they create.

I'll send an update when both of these features are turned on.

I'm hoping to have a preliminary version of a modified OWW Search box that
will only search pages within the Lab Notebook by the end of the week.

Currently, the only use option for the Lab Notebook is to enter content by
date and have it displayed by Project. We'll have a version that works the
opposite online soon that allows for the opposite: enter by product but view
the entries by date.

In both cases, you can also view and edit the original  date and project
entries.


There's a discussion page for Lab Notebook at the following URL:

http://openwetware.org/wiki/OpenWetWare:Software/Projects/Lab_Notebooks/Discussion

Please provide feedback. This is a preliminary version.

There's an overview document at the following location:

http://openwetware.org/wiki/OpenWetWare:Software/Projects/Lab_Notebooks/Overview

The following is a list of templates currently used in the Lab Notebook:

Template:LnNotebookCreate
Template:LnNotebookView
Template:LnNotebookCalendar
Template:LnNotebookIcon

Template:LnProjectBaseModify
Template:LnProjectCreate
Template:LnProjectView

Template:LnEntries
Template:LnEntryCurrent
Template:LnEntryDateHeader
Template:LnEntryImage
Template:LnEntryNavigate

The templates work in conjunction with  a set of extensions.  The extensions
and templates share a common internal structure. There is a set of variables
which we will be documenting that are accessible via the MediaWiki Template
languages. I'll provide more details when the initial components are all up
and running.

Be cautions if you immediately want to use this for your work. Any
information entered into the Lab Notebook will be safe. But the Project
display pages still are being tweaked. As I said, I will send out an update
message later this evening.

What you see is how I've initial set of the components together: the layout
is not carved in stone. This is more of an erector set than a static
application.

Please sound off about what you need this thing to do that it doesn't look
as if it will do now. We want to grow this out to meet as many requirements
aswe can.


Thanks.

Bill Flanagan
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From julius at younglucks.com  Tue Jan 15 11:52:43 2008
From: julius at younglucks.com (Julius B. Lucks)
Date: Tue, 15 Jan 2008 08:52:43 -0800
Subject: [OWW-SC] OWW User Feedback
Message-ID: <A5C64F68-0B0E-41DF-8C5B-6E5CD70AEB28@younglucks.com>

Hi SC,

We really need some way for an average user to give feedback to the  
SC about how to make OWW better, how they currently use it, etc.   
Outside of the survey, or someone finding the steering committee page  
on their own, there is really no mechanism to get general community  
feedback on how we are doing, and which direction we should take  
next.  I am hoping that as the SC blog is used more regularly, there  
will be useful comments on the posts, but I don't think that is enough.

How about some sort of 'Feedback' link in the navigation bar?  That  
way it can be seen on every page so that people reaching OWW from  
Google for example can still give feedback.  The link ideally would  
point to some sort of discussion forum with topic threads etc., but  
for now should just bring up some page that a user could fill in to  
email feedback at openwetware.org for example (email being simpler for  
newer users than editing the wiki).

What do you think?

Cheers,

Julius

------------------------------------------------------------------------ 
---------------
Please Reply to My Permanent Address: julius at younglucks.com
http://www.openwetware.org/wiki/User:Julius_B._Lucks
------------------------------------------------------------------------ 
----------------



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From yeem at MIT.EDU  Tue Jan 15 12:06:56 2008
From: yeem at MIT.EDU (M. Yee)
Date: Tue, 15 Jan 2008 12:06:56 -0500 (EST)
Subject: [OWW-SC] OWW User Feedback
In-Reply-To: <A5C64F68-0B0E-41DF-8C5B-6E5CD70AEB28@younglucks.com>
References: <A5C64F68-0B0E-41DF-8C5B-6E5CD70AEB28@younglucks.com>
Message-ID: <Pine.LNX.4.64L.0801151202030.8413@vinegar-pot.mit.edu>


This is a great idea, but how we implement feedback should depend on what
we expect out of it. Email might be the easiest way to go, but submitters
would not necessarily be expecting a response--more of a comment or
suggestion box in that case. If we're looking to start a discussion with
the user, perhaps a thread similar to the "Help" page would be useful.

Mike


On Tue, 15 Jan 2008, Julius B. Lucks wrote:

> Hi SC,
>
> We really need some way for an average user to give feedback to the SC about
> how to make OWW better, how they currently use it, etc.  Outside of the
> survey, or someone finding the steering committee page on their own, there is
> really no mechanism to get general community feedback on how we are doing, and
> which direction we should take next.  I am hoping that as the SC blog is used
> more regularly, there will be useful comments on the posts, but I don't think
> that is enough.
>
> How about some sort of 'Feedback' link in the navigation bar?  That way it can
> be seen on every page so that people reaching OWW from Google for example can
> still give feedback.  The link ideally would point to some sort of discussion
> forum with topic threads etc., but for now should just bring up some page that
> a user could fill in to email feedback at openwetware.org for example (email
> being simpler for newer users than editing the wiki).
>
> What do you think?
>
> Cheers,
>
> Julius
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Please Reply to My Permanent Address: julius at younglucks.com
> http://www.openwetware.org/wiki/User:Julius_B._Lucks
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
>
>


From julius at younglucks.com  Tue Jan 15 12:16:25 2008
From: julius at younglucks.com (Julius B. Lucks)
Date: Tue, 15 Jan 2008 09:16:25 -0800
Subject: [OWW-SC] OWW User Feedback
In-Reply-To: <Pine.LNX.4.64L.0801151202030.8413@vinegar-pot.mit.edu>
References: <A5C64F68-0B0E-41DF-8C5B-6E5CD70AEB28@younglucks.com>
	<Pine.LNX.4.64L.0801151202030.8413@vinegar-pot.mit.edu>
Message-ID: <B240C82B-2922-4903-98B9-9F765C1D262B@younglucks.com>

Hey Mike,

Good points. An email comment/suggestion box would already be a huge  
step forward, and might be the simplest thing to start off with.  We  
can always reply to individual emails, and we can gradually evolve  
the system into an email-based discussion board/list in the future.

We can also start a wiki-based page, but given how unwieldily long  
discussions are on the wiki, this might not be the best, especially  
for a new user who is hesitant to edit the wiki.

Of course, in the presence of no user-feedback on which one is best,  
we should do both!

Cheers,

Julius

------------------------------------------------------------------------ 
---------------
Please Reply to My Permanent Address: julius at younglucks.com
http://www.openwetware.org/wiki/User:Julius_B._Lucks
------------------------------------------------------------------------ 
----------------



On Jan 15, 2008, at 9:06 AM, M. Yee wrote:

>
> This is a great idea, but how we implement feedback should depend  
> on what
> we expect out of it. Email might be the easiest way to go, but  
> submitters
> would not necessarily be expecting a response--more of a comment or
> suggestion box in that case. If we're looking to start a discussion  
> with
> the user, perhaps a thread similar to the "Help" page would be useful.
>
> Mike
>
>
> On Tue, 15 Jan 2008, Julius B. Lucks wrote:
>
>> Hi SC,
>>
>> We really need some way for an average user to give feedback to  
>> the SC about
>> how to make OWW better, how they currently use it, etc.  Outside  
>> of the
>> survey, or someone finding the steering committee page on their  
>> own, there is
>> really no mechanism to get general community feedback on how we  
>> are doing, and
>> which direction we should take next.  I am hoping that as the SC  
>> blog is used
>> more regularly, there will be useful comments on the posts, but I  
>> don't think
>> that is enough.
>>
>> How about some sort of 'Feedback' link in the navigation bar?   
>> That way it can
>> be seen on every page so that people reaching OWW from Google for  
>> example can
>> still give feedback.  The link ideally would point to some sort of  
>> discussion
>> forum with topic threads etc., but for now should just bring up  
>> some page that
>> a user could fill in to email feedback at openwetware.org for example  
>> (email
>> being simpler for newer users than editing the wiki).
>>
>> What do you think?
>>
>> Cheers,
>>
>> Julius
>>
>> --------------------------------------------------------------------- 
>> ------------------
>> Please Reply to My Permanent Address: julius at younglucks.com
>> http://www.openwetware.org/wiki/User:Julius_B._Lucks
>> --------------------------------------------------------------------- 
>> -------------------
>>
>>
>>

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From bill.altmail at gmail.com  Tue Jan 15 13:33:49 2008
From: bill.altmail at gmail.com (Bill F)
Date: Tue, 15 Jan 2008 13:33:49 -0500
Subject: [OWW-SC] OWW User Feedback
In-Reply-To: <B240C82B-2922-4903-98B9-9F765C1D262B@younglucks.com>
References: <A5C64F68-0B0E-41DF-8C5B-6E5CD70AEB28@younglucks.com>
	<Pine.LNX.4.64L.0801151202030.8413@vinegar-pot.mit.edu>
	<B240C82B-2922-4903-98B9-9F765C1D262B@younglucks.com>
Message-ID: <26428aaa0801151033q70fcd5c5tb9a0a16023359f1a@mail.gmail.com>

I just downloaded and installed a comment tag that may be of use.

To try it add the following tag to any OWW page:

<comment />

See what you think.

This is a starting point. Ican change the code to either send an email
message to a specific address or to add the comment to another page besides
the one the tag is located upon.

Thanks.


B.


On Jan 15, 2008 12:16 PM, Julius B. Lucks <julius at younglucks.com> wrote:

> Hey Mike,
> Good points. An email comment/suggestion box would already be a huge step
> forward, and might be the simplest thing to start off with.  We can always
> reply to individual emails, and we can gradually evolve the system into an
> email-based discussion board/list in the future.
>
> We can also start a wiki-based page, but given how unwieldily long
> discussions are on the wiki, this might not be the best, especially for a
> new user who is hesitant to edit the wiki.
>
> Of course, in the presence of no user-feedback on which one is best, we
> should do both!
>
> Cheers,
>
> Julius
>
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Please Reply to My Permanent Address: julius at younglucks.com
> http://www.openwetware.org/wiki/User:Julius_B._Lucks
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
>
>
> On Jan 15, 2008, at 9:06 AM, M. Yee wrote:
>
>
> This is a great idea, but how we implement feedback should depend on what
> we expect out of it. Email might be the easiest way to go, but submitters
> would not necessarily be expecting a response--more of a comment or
> suggestion box in that case. If we're looking to start a discussion with
> the user, perhaps a thread similar to the "Help" page would be useful.
>
> Mike
>
>
> On Tue, 15 Jan 2008, Julius B. Lucks wrote:
>
> Hi SC,
>
> We really need some way for an average user to give feedback to the SC
> about
> how to make OWW better, how they currently use it, etc.  Outside of the
> survey, or someone finding the steering committee page on their own, there
> is
> really no mechanism to get general community feedback on how we are doing,
> and
> which direction we should take next.  I am hoping that as the SC blog is
> used
> more regularly, there will be useful comments on the posts, but I don't
> think
> that is enough.
>
> How about some sort of 'Feedback' link in the navigation bar?  That way it
> can
> be seen on every page so that people reaching OWW from Google for example
> can
> still give feedback.  The link ideally would point to some sort of
> discussion
> forum with topic threads etc., but for now should just bring up some page
> that
> a user could fill in to email feedback at openwetware.org for example (email
> being simpler for newer users than editing the wiki).
>
> What do you think?
>
> Cheers,
>
> Julius
>
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Please Reply to My Permanent Address: julius at younglucks.com
> http://www.openwetware.org/wiki/User:Julius_B._Lucks
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
>
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> OpenWetWare Steering Committee Mailing List
> sc at openwetware.org
> http://mailman.mit.edu/mailman/listinfo/oww-sc
>
>
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From julius at younglucks.com  Tue Jan 15 13:37:19 2008
From: julius at younglucks.com (Julius B. Lucks)
Date: Tue, 15 Jan 2008 10:37:19 -0800
Subject: [OWW-SC] OWW User Feedback
In-Reply-To: <26428aaa0801151033q70fcd5c5tb9a0a16023359f1a@mail.gmail.com>
References: <A5C64F68-0B0E-41DF-8C5B-6E5CD70AEB28@younglucks.com>
	<Pine.LNX.4.64L.0801151202030.8413@vinegar-pot.mit.edu>
	<B240C82B-2922-4903-98B9-9F765C1D262B@younglucks.com>
	<26428aaa0801151033q70fcd5c5tb9a0a16023359f1a@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <E44EDFE0-9A17-4FB1-A409-40CA453361D7@younglucks.com>

Hey Bill,

Would it be hard to make a link in the navigation bar that inserted  
the <comment/> tag into the page that the user was viewing?

Julius

------------------------------------------------------------------------ 
---------------
Please Reply to My Permanent Address: julius at younglucks.com
http://www.openwetware.org/wiki/User:Julius_B._Lucks
------------------------------------------------------------------------ 
----------------



On Jan 15, 2008, at 10:33 AM, Bill F wrote:

> I just downloaded and installed a comment tag that may be of use.
>
> To try it add the following tag to any OWW page:
>
> <comment />
>
> See what you think.
>
> This is a starting point. Ican change the code to either send an  
> email message to a specific address or to add the comment to  
> another page besides the one the tag is located upon.
>
> Thanks.
>
>
> B.
>
>
> On Jan 15, 2008 12:16 PM, Julius B. Lucks <julius at younglucks.com>  
> wrote:
> Hey Mike,
>
> Good points. An email comment/suggestion box would already be a  
> huge step forward, and might be the simplest thing to start off  
> with.  We can always reply to individual emails, and we can  
> gradually evolve the system into an email-based discussion board/ 
> list in the future.
>
> We can also start a wiki-based page, but given how unwieldily long  
> discussions are on the wiki, this might not be the best, especially  
> for a new user who is hesitant to edit the wiki.
>
> Of course, in the presence of no user-feedback on which one is  
> best, we should do both!
>
> Cheers,
>
> Julius
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------- 
> -----------------
> Please Reply to My Permanent Address: julius at younglucks.com
> http://www.openwetware.org/wiki/User:Julius_B._Lucks
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------- 
> ------------------
>
>
>
> On Jan 15, 2008, at 9:06 AM, M. Yee wrote:
>
>>
>> This is a great idea, but how we implement feedback should depend  
>> on what
>> we expect out of it. Email might be the easiest way to go, but  
>> submitters
>> would not necessarily be expecting a response--more of a comment or
>> suggestion box in that case. If we're looking to start a  
>> discussion with
>> the user, perhaps a thread similar to the "Help" page would be  
>> useful.
>>
>> Mike
>>
>>
>> On Tue, 15 Jan 2008, Julius B. Lucks wrote:
>>
>>> Hi SC,
>>>
>>> We really need some way for an average user to give feedback to  
>>> the SC about
>>> how to make OWW better, how they currently use it, etc.  Outside  
>>> of the
>>> survey, or someone finding the steering committee page on their  
>>> own, there is
>>> really no mechanism to get general community feedback on how we  
>>> are doing, and
>>> which direction we should take next.   I am hoping that as the SC  
>>> blog is used
>>> more regularly, there will be useful comments on the posts, but I  
>>> don't think
>>> that is enough.
>>>
>>> How about some sort of 'Feedback' link in the navigation bar?   
>>> That way it can
>>> be seen on every page so that people reaching OWW from Google for  
>>> example can
>>> still give feedback.  The link ideally would point to some sort  
>>> of discussion
>>> forum with topic threads etc., but for now should just bring up  
>>> some page that
>>> a user could fill in to email feedback at openwetware.org for  
>>> example (email
>>> being simpler for newer users than editing the wiki).
>>>
>>> What do you think?
>>>
>>> Cheers,
>>>
>>> Julius
>>>
>>> -------------------------------------------------------------------- 
>>> -------------------
>>> Please Reply to My Permanent Address: julius at younglucks.com
>>> http://www.openwetware.org/wiki/User:Julius_B._Lucks
>>> -------------------------------------------------------------------- 
>>> --------------------
>>>
>>>
>>>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> OpenWetWare Steering Committee Mailing List
> sc at openwetware.org
> http://mailman.mit.edu/mailman/listinfo/oww-sc
>
>

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From bill.altmail at gmail.com  Tue Jan 15 13:37:52 2008
From: bill.altmail at gmail.com (Bill F)
Date: Tue, 15 Jan 2008 13:37:52 -0500
Subject: [OWW-SC] OWW User Feedback
In-Reply-To: <26428aaa0801151033q70fcd5c5tb9a0a16023359f1a@mail.gmail.com>
References: <A5C64F68-0B0E-41DF-8C5B-6E5CD70AEB28@younglucks.com>
	<Pine.LNX.4.64L.0801151202030.8413@vinegar-pot.mit.edu>
	<B240C82B-2922-4903-98B9-9F765C1D262B@younglucks.com>
	<26428aaa0801151033q70fcd5c5tb9a0a16023359f1a@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <26428aaa0801151037n2545e128s9024094b298d2e5e@mail.gmail.com>

That's <comments />

Sorry!

I tested it. The comment goes onto the talk page.


On Jan 15, 2008 1:33 PM, Bill F <bill.altmail at gmail.com> wrote:

> I just downloaded and installed a comment tag that may be of use.
>
> To try it add the following tag to any OWW page:
>
> <comment />
>
> See what you think.
>
> This is a starting point. Ican change the code to either send an email
> message to a specific address or to add the comment to another page besides
> the one the tag is located upon.
>
> Thanks.
>
>
> B.
>
>
> On Jan 15, 2008 12:16 PM, Julius B. Lucks <julius at younglucks.com> wrote:
>
> >  Hey Mike,
> > Good points. An email comment/suggestion box would already be a huge
> > step forward, and might be the simplest thing to start off with.  We can
> > always reply to individual emails, and we can gradually evolve the system
> > into an email-based discussion board/list in the future.
> >
> > We can also start a wiki-based page, but given how unwieldily long
> > discussions are on the wiki, this might not be the best, especially for a
> > new user who is hesitant to edit the wiki.
> >
> > Of course, in the presence of no user-feedback on which one is best, we
> > should do both!
> >
> > Cheers,
> >
> > Julius
> >
> >
> > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> > Please Reply to My Permanent Address: julius at younglucks.com
> > http://www.openwetware.org/wiki/User:Julius_B._Lucks
> > ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > On Jan 15, 2008, at 9:06 AM, M. Yee wrote:
> >
> >
> > This is a great idea, but how we implement feedback should depend on
> > what
> > we expect out of it. Email might be the easiest way to go, but
> > submitters
> > would not necessarily be expecting a response--more of a comment or
> > suggestion box in that case. If we're looking to start a discussion with
> > the user, perhaps a thread similar to the "Help" page would be useful.
> >
> > Mike
> >
> >
> > On Tue, 15 Jan 2008, Julius B. Lucks wrote:
> >
> > Hi SC,
> >
> > We really need some way for an average user to give feedback to the SC
> > about
> > how to make OWW better, how they currently use it, etc.  Outside of the
> > survey, or someone finding the steering committee page on their own,
> > there is
> > really no mechanism to get general community feedback on how we are
> > doing, and
> > which direction we should take next.   I am hoping that as the SC blog
> > is used
> > more regularly, there will be useful comments on the posts, but I don't
> > think
> > that is enough.
> >
> > How about some sort of 'Feedback' link in the navigation bar?  That way
> > it can
> > be seen on every page so that people reaching OWW from Google for
> > example can
> > still give feedback.  The link ideally would point to some sort of
> > discussion
> > forum with topic threads etc., but for now should just bring up some
> > page that
> > a user could fill in to email feedback at openwetware.org for example
> > (email
> > being simpler for newer users than editing the wiki).
> >
> > What do you think?
> >
> > Cheers,
> >
> > Julius
> >
> >
> > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> > Please Reply to My Permanent Address: julius at younglucks.com
> > http://www.openwetware.org/wiki/User:Julius_B._Lucks
> >
> > ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > OpenWetWare Steering Committee Mailing List
> > sc at openwetware.org
> > http://mailman.mit.edu/mailman/listinfo/oww-sc
> >
> >
>
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From bill.altmail at gmail.com  Tue Jan 15 13:42:17 2008
From: bill.altmail at gmail.com (Bill F)
Date: Tue, 15 Jan 2008 13:42:17 -0500
Subject: [OWW-SC] OWW User Feedback
In-Reply-To: <E44EDFE0-9A17-4FB1-A409-40CA453361D7@younglucks.com>
References: <A5C64F68-0B0E-41DF-8C5B-6E5CD70AEB28@younglucks.com>
	<Pine.LNX.4.64L.0801151202030.8413@vinegar-pot.mit.edu>
	<B240C82B-2922-4903-98B9-9F765C1D262B@younglucks.com>
	<26428aaa0801151033q70fcd5c5tb9a0a16023359f1a@mail.gmail.com>
	<E44EDFE0-9A17-4FB1-A409-40CA453361D7@younglucks.com>
Message-ID: <26428aaa0801151042x18b6c73fobf0da2a3675ec91c@mail.gmail.com>

We can just create a page that has the tag in it and put a reference to the
page in the toolbox for "Feedback".

Anyone who wants to can put the Talk page in your Watchlist and receive
email notifications when they are created.

Again, it's "<omments /> and not <comment />.

The syntax looks odd but it's XHTML compliant: the training  " />" saves you
from creating an open and closing tag like this: <comments></comments>.

Let me put a demo page together and send a link. You can put anything you
want into the rest of the page you want to deliver.

B.



On Jan 15, 2008 1:37 PM, Julius B. Lucks <julius at younglucks.com> wrote:

> Hey Bill,
> Would it be hard to make a link in the navigation bar that inserted the
> <comment/> tag into the page that the user was viewing?
>
> Julius
>
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Please Reply to My Permanent Address: julius at younglucks.com
> http://www.openwetware.org/wiki/User:Julius_B._Lucks
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
>
>
> On Jan 15, 2008, at 10:33 AM, Bill F wrote:
>
> I just downloaded and installed a comment tag that may be of use.
>
> To try it add the following tag to any OWW page:
>
> <comment />
>
> See what you think.
>
> This is a starting point. Ican change the code to either send an email
> message to a specific address or to add the comment to another page besides
> the one the tag is located upon.
>
> Thanks.
>
>
> B.
>
>
> On Jan 15, 2008 12:16 PM, Julius B. Lucks <julius at younglucks.com> wrote:
>
> >  Hey Mike,
> > Good points. An email comment/suggestion box would already be a huge
> > step forward, and might be the simplest thing to start off with.  We can
> > always reply to individual emails, and we can gradually evolve the system
> > into an email-based discussion board/list in the future.
> >
> > We can also start a wiki-based page, but given how unwieldily long
> > discussions are on the wiki, this might not be the best, especially for a
> > new user who is hesitant to edit the wiki.
> >
> > Of course, in the presence of no user-feedback on which one is best, we
> > should do both!
> >
> > Cheers,
> >
> > Julius
> >
> >
> > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> > Please Reply to My Permanent Address: julius at younglucks.com
> > http://www.openwetware.org/wiki/User:Julius_B._Lucks
> > ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > On Jan 15, 2008, at 9:06 AM, M. Yee wrote:
> >
> >
> > This is a great idea, but how we implement feedback should depend on
> > what
> > we expect out of it. Email might be the easiest way to go, but
> > submitters
> > would not necessarily be expecting a response--more of a comment or
> > suggestion box in that case. If we're looking to start a discussion with
> > the user, perhaps a thread similar to the "Help" page would be useful.
> >
> > Mike
> >
> >
> > On Tue, 15 Jan 2008, Julius B. Lucks wrote:
> >
> > Hi SC,
> >
> > We really need some way for an average user to give feedback to the SC
> > about
> > how to make OWW better, how they currently use it, etc.  Outside of the
> > survey, or someone finding the steering committee page on their own,
> > there is
> > really no mechanism to get general community feedback on how we are
> > doing, and
> > which direction we should take next.   I am hoping that as the SC blog
> > is used
> > more regularly, there will be useful comments on the posts, but I don't
> > think
> > that is enough.
> >
> > How about some sort of 'Feedback' link in the navigation bar?  That way
> > it can
> > be seen on every page so that people reaching OWW from Google for
> > example can
> > still give feedback.  The link ideally would point to some sort of
> > discussion
> > forum with topic threads etc., but for now should just bring up some
> > page that
> > a user could fill in to email feedback at openwetware.org for example
> > (email
> > being simpler for newer users than editing the wiki).
> >
> > What do you think?
> >
> > Cheers,
> >
> > Julius
> >
> >
> > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> > Please Reply to My Permanent Address: julius at younglucks.com
> > http://www.openwetware.org/wiki/User:Julius_B._Lucks
> >
> > ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > OpenWetWare Steering Committee Mailing List
> > sc at openwetware.org
> > http://mailman.mit.edu/mailman/listinfo/oww-sc
> >
> >
>
>
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From bill.altmail at gmail.com  Tue Jan 15 13:50:38 2008
From: bill.altmail at gmail.com (Bill F)
Date: Tue, 15 Jan 2008 13:50:38 -0500
Subject: [OWW-SC] OWW User Feedback
In-Reply-To: <26428aaa0801151042x18b6c73fobf0da2a3675ec91c@mail.gmail.com>
References: <A5C64F68-0B0E-41DF-8C5B-6E5CD70AEB28@younglucks.com>
	<Pine.LNX.4.64L.0801151202030.8413@vinegar-pot.mit.edu>
	<B240C82B-2922-4903-98B9-9F765C1D262B@younglucks.com>
	<26428aaa0801151033q70fcd5c5tb9a0a16023359f1a@mail.gmail.com>
	<E44EDFE0-9A17-4FB1-A409-40CA453361D7@younglucks.com>
	<26428aaa0801151042x18b6c73fobf0da2a3675ec91c@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <26428aaa0801151050k4378b892mab43f29960d11add@mail.gmail.com>

On Jan 15, 2008 1:49 PM, Bill F <bill.altmail at gmail.com> wrote:
Take a look at this page:

http://openwetware.org/wiki/OpenWetWare:Feedback

I can add this to the toolbox when it does the right thing and looks right.



On Jan 15, 2008 1:42 PM, Bill F <bill.altmail at gmail.com> wrote:

> We can just create a page that has the tag in it and put a reference to
> the page in the toolbox for "Feedback".
>
> Anyone who wants to can put the Talk page in your Watchlist and receive
> email notifications when they are created.
>
> Again, it's "*<comments />" *and not *<comment />*.
>
> The syntax looks odd but it's XHTML compliant: the training  " />" saves
> you from creating an open and closing tag like this: <comments></comments>.
>
> Let me put a demo page together and send a link. You can put anything you
> want into the rest of the page you want to deliver.
>
> B.
>
>
>
>
> On Jan 15, 2008 1:37 PM, Julius B. Lucks < julius at younglucks.com> wrote:
>
> > Hey Bill,
> > Would it be hard to make a link in the navigation bar that inserted the
> > <comment/> tag into the page that the user was viewing?
> >
> > Julius
> >
> >
> > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> > Please Reply to My Permanent Address: julius at younglucks.com
> > http://www.openwetware.org/wiki/User:Julius_B._Lucks
> > ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > On Jan 15, 2008, at 10:33 AM, Bill F wrote:
> >
> > I just downloaded and installed a comment tag that may be of use.
> >
> > To try it add the following tag to any OWW page:
> >
> > <comment />
> >
> > See what you think.
> >
> > This is a starting point. Ican change the code to either send an email
> > message to a specific address or to add the comment to another page besides
> > the one the tag is located upon.
> >
> > Thanks.
> >
> >
> > B.
> >
> >
> > On Jan 15, 2008 12:16 PM, Julius B. Lucks <julius at younglucks.com> wrote:
> >
> > >  Hey Mike,
> > > Good points. An email comment/suggestion box would already be a huge
> > > step forward, and might be the simplest thing to start off with.  We can
> > > always reply to individual emails, and we can gradually evolve the system
> > > into an email-based discussion board/list in the future.
> > >
> > > We can also start a wiki-based page, but given how unwieldily long
> > > discussions are on the wiki, this might not be the best, especially for a
> > > new user who is hesitant to edit the wiki.
> > >
> > > Of course, in the presence of no user-feedback on which one is best,
> > > we should do both!
> > >
> > > Cheers,
> > >
> > > Julius
> > >
> > >
> > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> > > Please Reply to My Permanent Address: julius at younglucks.com
> > > http://www.openwetware.org/wiki/User:Julius_B._Lucks
> > > ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > On Jan 15, 2008, at 9:06 AM, M. Yee wrote:
> > >
> > >
> > > This is a great idea, but how we implement feedback should depend on
> > > what
> > > we expect out of it. Email might be the easiest way to go, but
> > > submitters
> > >  would not necessarily be expecting a response--more of a comment or
> > > suggestion box in that case. If we're looking to start a discussion
> > > with
> > > the user, perhaps a thread similar to the "Help" page would be useful.
> > >
> > >
> > > Mike
> > >
> > >
> > > On Tue, 15 Jan 2008, Julius B. Lucks wrote:
> > >
> > >  Hi SC,
> > >
> > > We really need some way for an average user to give feedback to the SC
> > > about
> > > how to make OWW better, how they currently use it, etc.   Outside of
> > > the
> > > survey, or someone finding the steering committee page on their own,
> > > there is
> > > really no mechanism to get general community feedback on how we are
> > > doing, and
> > > which direction we should take next.   I am hoping that as the SC blog
> > > is used
> > > more regularly, there will be useful comments on the posts, but I
> > > don't think
> > > that is enough.
> > >
> > > How about some sort of 'Feedback' link in the navigation bar?  That
> > > way it can
> > > be seen on every page so that people reaching OWW from Google for
> > > example can
> > > still give feedback.  The link ideally would point to some sort of
> > > discussion
> > > forum with topic threads etc., but for now should just bring up some
> > > page that
> > > a user could fill in to email feedback at openwetware.org for example
> > > (email
> > > being simpler for newer users than editing the wiki).
> > >
> > > What do you think?
> > >
> > > Cheers,
> > >
> > > Julius
> > >
> > >
> > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> > > Please Reply to My Permanent Address: julius at younglucks.com
> > > http://www.openwetware.org/wiki/User:Julius_B._Lucks
> > >
> > > ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > OpenWetWare Steering Committee Mailing List
> > > sc at openwetware.org
> > > http://mailman.mit.edu/mailman/listinfo/oww-sc
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
>
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From bill.altmail at gmail.com  Tue Jan 15 14:44:45 2008
From: bill.altmail at gmail.com (Bill F)
Date: Tue, 15 Jan 2008 14:44:45 -0500
Subject: [OWW-SC] OWW User Feedback
In-Reply-To: <F0F9FFC0-4366-4A23-A10C-5E002E228307@younglucks.com>
References: <A5C64F68-0B0E-41DF-8C5B-6E5CD70AEB28@younglucks.com>
	<Pine.LNX.4.64L.0801151202030.8413@vinegar-pot.mit.edu>
	<B240C82B-2922-4903-98B9-9F765C1D262B@younglucks.com>
	<26428aaa0801151033q70fcd5c5tb9a0a16023359f1a@mail.gmail.com>
	<E44EDFE0-9A17-4FB1-A409-40CA453361D7@younglucks.com>
	<26428aaa0801151042x18b6c73fobf0da2a3675ec91c@mail.gmail.com>
	<26428aaa0801151049p73071415t113775abd1a98e31@mail.gmail.com>
	<4033D5B1-A57D-4BA4-87E7-767BA8C1868C@younglucks.com>
	<26428aaa0801151056i5c43c108wb922574b1357b950@mail.gmail.com>
	<F0F9FFC0-4366-4A23-A10C-5E002E228307@younglucks.com>
Message-ID: <26428aaa0801151144u1c3f2337n906382412bdc89c6@mail.gmail.com>

Here's an alternative that uses a technique Jason brought to my attention:

http://openwetware.org/wiki/OpenWetWare:Feedback

I need to get the correct mailing list name and it's done. We can clean it
up later but it will work as soon as I get the mailing list set up.

As for where it is needs to be displayed, please let me know exactly where
you want me to put it.

Thanks.

B.



On Jan 15, 2008 2:01 PM, Julius B. Lucks <julius at younglucks.com> wrote:

> Sure - let's try it.
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Please Reply to My Permanent Address: julius at younglucks.com
> http://www.openwetware.org/wiki/User:Julius_B._Lucks
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
>
>
> On Jan 15, 2008, at 10:56 AM, Bill F wrote:
>
> I put a link on the page already But... I think it would be better to list
> the comments on the same page in this case.
>
> I can change the code so that the comment goes onto the page itself rather
> than onto the talk page.
>
> Tell me if that works. If so, I can have it turned on in a few minutes.
>
> B.
>
>
> On Jan 15, 2008 1:51 PM, Julius B. Lucks <julius at younglucks.com > wrote:
>
> > Wow,
> > That is excellent!  One thing - can we have a link to see all the
> > comments from http://openwetware.org/wiki/OpenWetWare:Feedback - right
> > now there is only leave a comment, but you would not be able to see all the
> > comments if you don't leave one.
> >
> > J
> >
> >
> > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> > Please Reply to My Permanent Address: julius at younglucks.com
> > http://www.openwetware.org/wiki/User:Julius_B._Lucks
> > ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > On Jan 15, 2008, at 10:49 AM, Bill F wrote:
> >
> > Take a look at this page:
> >
> > http://openwetware.org/wiki/OpenWetWare:Feedback
> >
> > I can add this to the toolbox when it does the right thing and looks
> > right.
> >
> >
> > On Jan 15, 2008 1:42 PM, Bill F <bill.altmail at gmail.com> wrote:
> >
> > > We can just create a page that has the tag in it and put a reference
> > > to the page in the toolbox for "Feedback".
> > >
> > > Anyone who wants to can put the Talk page in your Watchlist and
> > > receive email notifications when they are created.
> > >
> > > Again, it's "<comments /> and not <comment />.
> > >
> > > The syntax looks odd but it's XHTML compliant: the training  " />"
> > > saves you from creating an open and closing tag like this:
> > > <comments></comments>.
> > >
> > > Let me put a demo page together and send a link. You can put anything
> > > you want into the rest of the page you want to deliver.
> > >
> > > B.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > On Jan 15, 2008 1:37 PM, Julius B. Lucks < julius at younglucks.com>
> > > wrote:
> > >
> > > >  Hey Bill,
> > > > Would it be hard to make a link in the navigation bar that inserted
> > > > the <comment/> tag into the page that the user was viewing?
> > > >
> > > > Julius
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> > > > Please Reply to My Permanent Address: julius at younglucks.com
> > > > http://www.openwetware.org/wiki/User:Julius_B._Lucks
> > > > ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > On Jan 15, 2008, at 10:33 AM, Bill F wrote:
> > > >
> > > > I just downloaded and installed a comment tag that may be of use.
> > > >
> > > > To try it add the following tag to any OWW page:
> > > >
> > > > <comment />
> > > >
> > > > See what you think.
> > > >
> > > > This is a starting point. Ican change the code to either send an
> > > > email message to a specific address or to add the comment to another page
> > > > besides the one the tag is located upon.
> > > >
> > > > Thanks.
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > B.
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > On Jan 15, 2008 12:16 PM, Julius B. Lucks <julius at younglucks.com>
> > > > wrote:
> > > >
> > > > >  Hey Mike,
> > > > > Good points. An email comment/suggestion box would already be a
> > > > > huge step forward, and might be the simplest thing to start off with.  We
> > > > > can always reply to individual emails, and we can gradually evolve the
> > > > > system into an email-based discussion board/list in the future.
> > > > >
> > > > > We can also start a wiki-based page, but given how unwieldily long
> > > > > discussions are on the wiki, this might not be the best, especially for a
> > > > > new user who is hesitant to edit the wiki.
> > > > >
> > > > > Of course, in the presence of no user-feedback on which one is
> > > > > best, we should do both!
> > > > >
> > > > > Cheers,
> > > > >
> > > > > Julius
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> > > > > Please Reply to My Permanent Address: julius at younglucks.com
> > > > > http://www.openwetware.org/wiki/User:Julius_B._Lucks
> > > > > ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > On Jan 15, 2008, at 9:06 AM, M. Yee wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > This is a great idea, but how we implement feedback should depend
> > > > > on what
> > > > > we expect out of it. Email might be the easiest way to go, but
> > > > > submitters
> > > > >  would not necessarily be expecting a response--more of a comment
> > > > > or
> > > > > suggestion box in that case. If we're looking to start a
> > > > > discussion with
> > > > > the user, perhaps a thread similar to the "Help" page would be
> > > > > useful.
> > > > >
> > > > > Mike
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > On Tue, 15 Jan 2008, Julius B. Lucks wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > >  Hi SC,
> > > > >
> > > > > We really need some way for an average user to give feedback to
> > > > > the SC about
> > > > > how to make OWW better, how they currently use it, etc.   Outside
> > > > > of the
> > > > > survey, or someone finding the steering committee page on their
> > > > > own, there is
> > > > > really no mechanism to get general community feedback on how we
> > > > > are doing, and
> > > > > which direction we should take next.   I am hoping that as the SC
> > > > > blog is used
> > > > > more regularly, there will be useful comments on the posts, but I
> > > > > don't think
> > > > > that is enough.
> > > > >
> > > > > How about some sort of 'Feedback' link in the navigation bar?  That
> > > > > way it can
> > > > > be seen on every page so that people reaching OWW from Google for
> > > > > example can
> > > > > still give feedback.  The link ideally would point to some sort of
> > > > > discussion
> > > > > forum with topic threads etc., but for now should just bring up
> > > > > some page that
> > > > > a user could fill in to email feedback at openwetware.org for example
> > > > > (email
> > > > > being simpler for newer users than editing the wiki).
> > > > >
> > > > > What do you think?
> > > > >
> > > > > Cheers,
> > > > >
> > > > > Julius
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> > > > > Please Reply to My Permanent Address: julius at younglucks.com
> > > > > http://www.openwetware.org/wiki/User:Julius_B._Lucks
> > > > >
> > > > > ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > _______________________________________________
> > > > > OpenWetWare Steering Committee Mailing List
> > > > > sc at openwetware.org
> > > > > http://mailman.mit.edu/mailman/listinfo/oww-sc
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > >
> >
> >
>
>
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From jasonk at MIT.EDU  Tue Jan 15 14:56:10 2008
From: jasonk at MIT.EDU (Jason Kelly)
Date: Tue, 15 Jan 2008 14:56:10 -0500
Subject: [OWW-SC] new user page genration
Message-ID: <7c085c480801151156h4df517a6p9ed693b4494366f@mail.gmail.com>

We'll be having a fair number of new users coming on the site due to
Spring classes -- reshma made some comments on this page:
http://openwetware.org/wiki/OpenWetWare_talk:Software/User_management

that I wanted to make sure people saw:

"In watching new users who've come on since the auto-generation of
user pages, I've noticed that there still seems to be some reluctance
by new users to actually edit their own pages despite the message
inviting them to do so. I wonder if we should instead populate
people's user pages with an outline of a page e.g., the structure
found at OpenWetWare:Getting started 2 for example. I think it is
actually easier for people to edit a page with some structure and fill
in the blanks etc. What do people think? We could try it for a while
and see how it goes?"

I think this might be true, though I know Julius was keeping an eye on
new users pages for awhile after the change.

Julius, what do you think about moving the content on this page:
http://openwetware.org/wiki/UserPageDefaultContentText

To the talk page generated for the user, and having the actual user
page just be a wire frame that they can easily fill in?

thanks,
jason


From julius at younglucks.com  Tue Jan 15 19:39:04 2008
From: julius at younglucks.com (Julius B. Lucks)
Date: Tue, 15 Jan 2008 16:39:04 -0800
Subject: [OWW-SC] OWW User Feedback
In-Reply-To: <26428aaa0801151144u1c3f2337n906382412bdc89c6@mail.gmail.com>
References: <A5C64F68-0B0E-41DF-8C5B-6E5CD70AEB28@younglucks.com>
	<Pine.LNX.4.64L.0801151202030.8413@vinegar-pot.mit.edu>
	<B240C82B-2922-4903-98B9-9F765C1D262B@younglucks.com>
	<26428aaa0801151033q70fcd5c5tb9a0a16023359f1a@mail.gmail.com>
	<E44EDFE0-9A17-4FB1-A409-40CA453361D7@younglucks.com>
	<26428aaa0801151042x18b6c73fobf0da2a3675ec91c@mail.gmail.com>
	<26428aaa0801151049p73071415t113775abd1a98e31@mail.gmail.com>
	<4033D5B1-A57D-4BA4-87E7-767BA8C1868C@younglucks.com>
	<26428aaa0801151056i5c43c108wb922574b1357b950@mail.gmail.com>
	<F0F9FFC0-4366-4A23-A10C-5E002E228307@younglucks.com>
	<26428aaa0801151144u1c3f2337n906382412bdc89c6@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <067DA2C0-5BB3-4CB2-89C0-6B74BDB16CE6@younglucks.com>

Can we have both - sending the comments to a mailing list, as well as  
being posted on the wiki.  That way we can try out which one we like  
best.

I'll be happy to read the emails when the mailing list is set up.

Cheers,

Julius
------------------------------------------------------------------------ 
---------------
Please Reply to My Permanent Address: julius at younglucks.com
http://www.openwetware.org/wiki/User:Julius_B._Lucks
------------------------------------------------------------------------ 
----------------



On Jan 15, 2008, at 11:44 AM, Bill F wrote:

> Here's an alternative that uses a technique Jason brought to my  
> attention:
>
> http://openwetware.org/wiki/OpenWetWare:Feedback
>
> I need to get the correct mailing list name and it's done. We can  
> clean it up later but it will work as soon as I get the mailing  
> list set up.
>
> As for where it is needs to be displayed, please let me know  
> exactly where you want me to put it.
>
> Thanks.
>
> B.
>
>
>
> On Jan 15, 2008 2:01 PM, Julius B. Lucks < julius at younglucks.com>  
> wrote:
> Sure - let's try it.
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------- 
> -----------------
> Please Reply to My Permanent Address: julius at younglucks.com
> http://www.openwetware.org/wiki/User:Julius_B._Lucks
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------- 
> ------------------
>
>
>
> On Jan 15, 2008, at 10:56 AM, Bill F wrote:
>
>> I put a link on the page already But... I think it would be better  
>> to list the comments on the same page in this case.
>>
>> I can change the code so that the comment goes onto the page  
>> itself rather than onto the talk page.
>>
>> Tell me if that works. If so, I can have it turned on in a few  
>> minutes.
>>
>> B.
>>
>>
>> On Jan 15, 2008 1:51 PM, Julius B. Lucks < julius at younglucks.com >  
>> wrote:
>> Wow,
>>
>> That is excellent!  One thing - can we have a link to see all the  
>> comments from  http://openwetware.org/wiki/OpenWetWare:Feedback -  
>> right now there is only leave a comment, but you would not be able  
>> to see all the comments if you don't leave one.
>>
>> J
>>
>> --------------------------------------------------------------------- 
>> ------------------
>> Please Reply to My Permanent Address: julius at younglucks.com
>> http://www.openwetware.org/wiki/User:Julius_B._Lucks
>> --------------------------------------------------------------------- 
>> -------------------
>>
>>
>>
>> On Jan 15, 2008, at 10:49 AM, Bill F wrote:
>>
>>> Take a look at this page:
>>>
>>> http://openwetware.org/wiki/OpenWetWare:Feedback
>>>
>>> I can add this to the toolbox when it does the right thing and  
>>> looks right.
>>>
>>>
>>> On Jan 15, 2008 1:42 PM, Bill F <bill.altmail at gmail.com> wrote:
>>> We can just create a page that has the tag in it and put a  
>>> reference to the page in the toolbox for "Feedback".
>>>
>>> Anyone who wants to can put the Talk page in your Watchlist and  
>>> receive email notifications when they are created.
>>>
>>> Again, it's "<comments /> and not <comment />.
>>>
>>> The syntax looks odd but it's XHTML compliant: the training  " / 
>>> >" saves you from creating an open and closing tag like this:  
>>> <comments></comments>.
>>>
>>> Let me put a demo page together and send a link. You can put  
>>> anything you want into the rest of the page you want to deliver.
>>>
>>> B.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On Jan 15, 2008 1:37 PM, Julius B. Lucks < julius at younglucks.com>  
>>> wrote:
>>> Hey Bill,
>>>
>>> Would it be hard to make a link in the navigation bar that  
>>> inserted the <comment/> tag into the page that the user was viewing?
>>>
>>> Julius
>>>
>>> -------------------------------------------------------------------- 
>>> -------------------
>>> Please Reply to My Permanent Address: julius at younglucks.com
>>> http://www.openwetware.org/wiki/User:Julius_B._Lucks
>>> -------------------------------------------------------------------- 
>>> --------------------
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On Jan 15, 2008, at 10:33 AM, Bill F wrote:
>>>
>>>> I just downloaded and installed a comment tag that may be of use.
>>>>
>>>> To try it add the following tag to any OWW page:
>>>>
>>>> <comment />
>>>>
>>>> See what you think.
>>>>
>>>> This is a starting point. Ican change the code to either send an  
>>>> email message to a specific address or to add the comment to  
>>>> another page besides the one the tag is located upon.
>>>>
>>>> Thanks.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> B.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On Jan 15, 2008 12:16 PM, Julius B. Lucks  
>>>> <julius at younglucks.com> wrote:
>>>> Hey Mike,
>>>>
>>>> Good points. An email comment/suggestion box would already be a  
>>>> huge step forward, and might be the simplest thing to start off  
>>>> with.  We can always reply to individual emails, and we can  
>>>> gradually evolve the system into an email-based discussion board/ 
>>>> list in the future.
>>>>
>>>> We can also start a wiki-based page, but given how unwieldily  
>>>> long discussions are on the wiki, this might not be the best,  
>>>> especially for a new user who is hesitant to edit the wiki.
>>>>
>>>> Of course, in the presence of no user-feedback on which one is  
>>>> best, we should do both!
>>>>
>>>> Cheers,
>>>>
>>>> Julius
>>>>
>>>> ------------------------------------------------------------------- 
>>>> --------------------
>>>> Please Reply to My Permanent Address: julius at younglucks.com
>>>> http://www.openwetware.org/wiki/User:Julius_B._Lucks
>>>> ------------------------------------------------------------------- 
>>>> ---------------------
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On Jan 15, 2008, at 9:06 AM, M. Yee wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> This is a great idea, but how we implement feedback should  
>>>>> depend on what
>>>>> we expect out of it. Email might be the easiest way to go, but  
>>>>> submitters
>>>>> would not necessarily be expecting a response--more of a  
>>>>> comment or
>>>>> suggestion box in that case. If we're looking to start a  
>>>>> discussion with
>>>>> the user, perhaps a thread similar to the "Help" page would be  
>>>>> useful.
>>>>>
>>>>> Mike
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> On Tue, 15 Jan 2008, Julius B. Lucks wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> Hi SC,
>>>>>>
>>>>>> We really need some way for an average user to give feedback  
>>>>>> to the SC about
>>>>>> how to make OWW better, how they currently use it, etc.    
>>>>>> Outside of the
>>>>>> survey, or someone finding the steering committee page on  
>>>>>> their own, there is
>>>>>> really no mechanism to get general community feedback on how  
>>>>>> we are doing, and
>>>>>> which direction we should take next.   I am hoping that as the  
>>>>>> SC blog is used
>>>>>> more regularly, there will be useful comments on the posts,  
>>>>>> but I don't think
>>>>>> that is enough.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> How about some sort of 'Feedback' link in the navigation bar?   
>>>>>> That way it can
>>>>>> be seen on every page so that people reaching OWW from Google  
>>>>>> for example can
>>>>>> still give feedback.  The link ideally would point to some  
>>>>>> sort of discussion
>>>>>> forum with topic threads etc., but for now should just bring  
>>>>>> up some page that
>>>>>> a user could fill in to email feedback at openwetware.org for  
>>>>>> example (email
>>>>>> being simpler for newer users than editing the wiki).
>>>>>>
>>>>>> What do you think?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Cheers,
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Julius
>>>>>>
>>>>>> ----------------------------------------------------------------- 
>>>>>> ----------------------
>>>>>> Please Reply to My Permanent Address: julius at younglucks.com
>>>>>> http://www.openwetware.org/wiki/User:Julius_B._Lucks
>>>>>> ----------------------------------------------------------------- 
>>>>>> -----------------------
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> OpenWetWare Steering Committee Mailing List
>>>> sc at openwetware.org
>>>> http://mailman.mit.edu/mailman/listinfo/oww-sc
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>
>

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From julius at younglucks.com  Tue Jan 15 19:39:31 2008
From: julius at younglucks.com (Julius B. Lucks)
Date: Tue, 15 Jan 2008 16:39:31 -0800
Subject: [OWW-SC] new user page genration
In-Reply-To: <7c085c480801151156h4df517a6p9ed693b4494366f@mail.gmail.com>
References: <7c085c480801151156h4df517a6p9ed693b4494366f@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <171447FB-ADC6-4568-BE77-A72099C13D2A@younglucks.com>

>
> Julius, what do you think about moving the content on this page:
> http://openwetware.org/wiki/UserPageDefaultContentText
>
> To the talk page generated for the user, and having the actual user
> page just be a wire frame that they can easily fill in?
>

That makes sense to me.

Julius



From julius at younglucks.com  Tue Jan 15 19:51:45 2008
From: julius at younglucks.com (Julius B. Lucks)
Date: Tue, 15 Jan 2008 16:51:45 -0800
Subject: [OWW-SC] POWW!
In-Reply-To: <D477C572-4BED-482D-8F3C-1E828F4F1CFD@mit.edu>
References: <FBA4E68D-F632-4B03-BA7E-06F5CC02AB37@mit.edu>
	<477F2435.1080800@gmail.com>
	<D477C572-4BED-482D-8F3C-1E828F4F1CFD@mit.edu>
Message-ID: <F44CF298-0FDF-4629-A11F-2C2F84073989@younglucks.com>

Sorry to be late on this discussion, but the tactic of arXiv from the  
beginning has been to have a completely latex-based system.   
Submitting to the arXiv is not much more than giving them your latex  
file and figure files, and they put them together in the same way as  
you do when you work on them.  It would be a big jump to force people  
to use latex, but having the primary document source be a text file  
makes the piplelines much easier.

In any case, there is a nice background article about Paul Ginsparg  
(founder of the arXiv) called "Can Peer Review Be Better Focused?"  
that has some interesting thoughts/ideas - http:// 
people.ccmr.cornell.edu/~ginsparg/blurb/pg02pr.html .

Cheers,

Julius

------------------------------------------------------------------------ 
---------------
Please Reply to My Permanent Address: julius at younglucks.com
http://www.openwetware.org/wiki/User:Julius_B._Lucks
------------------------------------------------------------------------ 
----------------



On Jan 5, 2008, at 7:09 AM, Drew Endy wrote:

> I think an important thing to start with is the remove the
> "transaction costs" associated with submitting, revising, and proofing
> a manuscript.  This takes way too much time at present, even for the
> most enlightened and wealthy journals.  A wiki-based (or better)
> platform could almost completely remove these costs.
>
>
>
> On Jan 5, 2008, at 1:31 AM, Lon Chubiz wrote:
>
>> An interesting feature might be to have an effective mechanism to
>> request strains, plasmids, code, etc. from the authors. Maybe as
>> part of the materials and methods users/readers could add these
>> things like items to a "shopping cart" or something which would send
>> a request for them. I haven't seen anything like that before with a
>> journal. Perhaps, that could factor into some of the updated content
>> ideas others have mentioned. Send stuff out and add in responses on
>> how your stuff works in other hands.
>>
>> Lon
>>
>> Drew Endy wrote:
>>> Does anybody want to start a new peer-reviewed Wiki-based journal?
>>>
>>> POWW (Proceedings of the Open Wet Ware)
>>>
>>> Thoughts?
>>>
>>> Happy 2008!
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> OpenWetWare Steering Committee Mailing List
>>> sc at openwetware.org
>>> http://mailman.mit.edu/mailman/listinfo/oww-sc
>>>
>>
>
> _______________________________________________
> OpenWetWare Steering Committee Mailing List
> sc at openwetware.org
> http://mailman.mit.edu/mailman/listinfo/oww-sc

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From jasonk at MIT.EDU  Wed Jan 16 01:23:24 2008
From: jasonk at MIT.EDU (Jason Kelly)
Date: Wed, 16 Jan 2008 01:23:24 -0500
Subject: [OWW-SC] Main page & SC blog
Message-ID: <7c085c480801152223v46baa8a9xff8adc3e802265c1@mail.gmail.com>

hey SC,

The main page has been updated to pull from the SC blog for new news
items.  Thanks Julius for posting one!  If you don't have an account
on the SC blog let me know.  If you do, then feel free to post by
logging in here:

http://blog.openwetware.org/sc/wp-login.php

John, thanks for volunteering to cajole folks into posting / keep the
blog semi-fresh - you are now chief pundit of the OWW homepage ;)

thanks!
jason


From jasonk at MIT.EDU  Wed Jan 16 01:50:32 2008
From: jasonk at MIT.EDU (Jason Kelly)
Date: Wed, 16 Jan 2008 01:50:32 -0500
Subject: [OWW-SC] new user page genration
In-Reply-To: <171447FB-ADC6-4568-BE77-A72099C13D2A@younglucks.com>
References: <7c085c480801151156h4df517a6p9ed693b4494366f@mail.gmail.com>
	<171447FB-ADC6-4568-BE77-A72099C13D2A@younglucks.com>
Message-ID: <7c085c480801152250i7c788546l1cae3700c5e6f482@mail.gmail.com>

OK, I replaced the auto-generated userpage (thanks reshma for making
up the new version).  You can see it here:
http://openwetware.org/wiki/UserPageDefaultContentText

I moved the old content to the auto-generated talk page:
http://openwetware.org/wiki/UserTalkPageDefaultContentText

I tried to update the text so it makes sense, please take a look and
edit if you have a chance.  Keep in mind these are the first pages new
users will see / edit.

thanks!
jason

On Jan 15, 2008 7:39 PM, Julius B. Lucks <julius at younglucks.com> wrote:
> >
> > Julius, what do you think about moving the content on this page:
> > http://openwetware.org/wiki/UserPageDefaultContentText
> >
> > To the talk page generated for the user, and having the actual user
> > page just be a wire frame that they can easily fill in?
> >
>
> That makes sense to me.
>
> Julius
>
>


From bill.altmail at gmail.com  Wed Jan 16 08:48:41 2008
From: bill.altmail at gmail.com (Bill F)
Date: Wed, 16 Jan 2008 08:48:41 -0500
Subject: [OWW-SC] Lab Notebook: "One last thing..."
Message-ID: <26428aaa0801160548p29963eb6j3dae376bc5d4d23@mail.gmail.com>

Sorry.

No free  pound portable loaded with OWW Lab Notebook to announce.


I am fixing a problem in the Lab Notebook that came up when I moved it to
the main wiki. As you may have noticed, the there was a "stickiness" related
to how the focus of the notebook was connected to the person logged in
rather than the one you may be looking at. I made the change and resolved
the problem. The next step is to turn on the project update feature. I had
to retest it after making the previously cited fix. I'll send out an update
as soon as it's working.

Sorry for any inconvenience.

Bill Flanagan
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From bill.altmail at gmail.com  Wed Jan 16 11:35:05 2008
From: bill.altmail at gmail.com (Bill F)
Date: Wed, 16 Jan 2008 11:35:05 -0500
Subject: [OWW-SC] Lab Notebook: "One last thing..."
Message-ID: <26428aaa0801160835r28b28067qe557f2d7d9dddd42@mail.gmail.com>

I'm sorry for the delay on updating the OWW Lab Notebook. There's a glitch
that I became aware of when I moved the code and templates onto the main OWW
server. This problem has been fixed on my test wiki. I'm in the process of
moving it over to OWW now. I'll let you know when it's ready.


Thanks for your patience!

Bill Flanagan
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From bill.altmail at gmail.com  Wed Jan 16 12:30:07 2008
From: bill.altmail at gmail.com (Bill F)
Date: Wed, 16 Jan 2008 12:30:07 -0500
Subject: [OWW-SC] OWW User Feedback
In-Reply-To: <067DA2C0-5BB3-4CB2-89C0-6B74BDB16CE6@younglucks.com>
References: <A5C64F68-0B0E-41DF-8C5B-6E5CD70AEB28@younglucks.com>
	<26428aaa0801151033q70fcd5c5tb9a0a16023359f1a@mail.gmail.com>
	<E44EDFE0-9A17-4FB1-A409-40CA453361D7@younglucks.com>
	<26428aaa0801151042x18b6c73fobf0da2a3675ec91c@mail.gmail.com>
	<26428aaa0801151049p73071415t113775abd1a98e31@mail.gmail.com>
	<4033D5B1-A57D-4BA4-87E7-767BA8C1868C@younglucks.com>
	<26428aaa0801151056i5c43c108wb922574b1357b950@mail.gmail.com>
	<F0F9FFC0-4366-4A23-A10C-5E002E228307@younglucks.com>
	<26428aaa0801151144u1c3f2337n906382412bdc89c6@mail.gmail.com>
	<067DA2C0-5BB3-4CB2-89C0-6B74BDB16CE6@younglucks.com>
Message-ID: <26428aaa0801160930y5dcd55a2yc786e7465a402b6e@mail.gmail.com>

Feedback is online.

http://openwetware.org/index.php?title=Special:Contact

I've set up the mailing list, forwarding mechanisms, email addresses, and a
working email form to support OWW Feedback. The list and mail send support
is online.

Please note: There is still some additional information needed before the
list is publicized at OWW. But the system is ready to roll. Follow the links
in the OWW article referenced below to find the mailing list and add
yourself to it.

You can read about the details and get instructions on how to join the list
here:

http://openwetware.org/index.php?title=OpenWetWare:Software/Projects/Feedback



On Jan 15, 2008 7:39 PM, Julius B. Lucks <julius at younglucks.com> wrote:

> Can we have both - sending the comments to a mailing list, as well as
> being posted on the wiki.  That way we can try out which one we like best.
> I'll be happy to read the emails when the mailing list is set up.
>
> Cheers,
>
> Julius
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Please Reply to My Permanent Address: julius at younglucks.com
> http://www.openwetware.org/wiki/User:Julius_B._Lucks
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
>
>
> On Jan 15, 2008, at 11:44 AM, Bill F wrote:
>
> Here's an alternative that uses a technique Jason brought to my attention:
>
> http://openwetware.org/wiki/OpenWetWare:Feedback
>
> I need to get the correct mailing list name and it's done. We can clean it
> up later but it will work as soon as I get the mailing list set up.
>
> As for where it is needs to be displayed, please let me know exactly where
> you want me to put it.
>
> Thanks.
>
> B.
>
>
>
> On Jan 15, 2008 2:01 PM, Julius B. Lucks < julius at younglucks.com> wrote:
>
> > Sure - let's try it.
> >
> > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> > Please Reply to My Permanent Address: julius at younglucks.com
> > http://www.openwetware.org/wiki/User:Julius_B._Lucks
> > ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > On Jan 15, 2008, at 10:56 AM, Bill F wrote:
> >
> > I put a link on the page already But... I think it would be better to
> > list the comments on the same page in this case.
> >
> > I can change the code so that the comment goes onto the page itself
> > rather than onto the talk page.
> >
> > Tell me if that works. If so, I can have it turned on in a few minutes.
> >
> > B.
> >
> >
> > On Jan 15, 2008 1:51 PM, Julius B. Lucks < julius at younglucks.com >
> > wrote:
> >
> > > Wow,
> > > That is excellent!  One thing - can we have a link to see all the
> > > comments from  http://openwetware.org/wiki/OpenWetWare:Feedback -
> > > right now there is only leave a comment, but you would not be able to see
> > > all the comments if you don't leave one.
> > >
> > > J
> > >
> > >
> > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> > > Please Reply to My Permanent Address: julius at younglucks.com
> > > http://www.openwetware.org/wiki/User:Julius_B._Lucks
> > > ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > On Jan 15, 2008, at 10:49 AM, Bill F wrote:
> > >
> > > Take a look at this page:
> > >
> > > http://openwetware.org/wiki/OpenWetWare:Feedback
> > >
> > > I can add this to the toolbox when it does the right thing and looks
> > > right.
> > >
> > >
> > > On Jan 15, 2008 1:42 PM, Bill F <bill.altmail at gmail.com> wrote:
> > >
> > > > We can just create a page that has the tag in it and put a reference
> > > > to the page in the toolbox for "Feedback".
> > > >
> > > > Anyone who wants to can put the Talk page in your Watchlist and
> > > > receive email notifications when they are created.
> > > >
> > > > Again, it's "<comments /> and not <comment />.
> > > >
> > > > The syntax looks odd but it's XHTML compliant: the training  " />"
> > > > saves you from creating an open and closing tag like this:
> > > > <comments></comments>.
> > > >
> > > > Let me put a demo page together and send a link. You can put
> > > > anything you want into the rest of the page you want to deliver.
> > > >
> > > > B.
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > On Jan 15, 2008 1:37 PM, Julius B. Lucks < julius at younglucks.com>
> > > > wrote:
> > > >
> > > > >  Hey Bill,
> > > > > Would it be hard to make a link in the navigation bar that
> > > > > inserted the <comment/> tag into the page that the user was viewing?
> > > > >
> > > > > Julius
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> > > > > Please Reply to My Permanent Address: julius at younglucks.com
> > > > > http://www.openwetware.org/wiki/User:Julius_B._Lucks
> > > > > ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > On Jan 15, 2008, at 10:33 AM, Bill F wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > I just downloaded and installed a comment tag that may be of use.
> > > > >
> > > > > To try it add the following tag to any OWW page:
> > > > >
> > > > > <comment />
> > > > >
> > > > > See what you think.
> > > > >
> > > > > This is a starting point. Ican change the code to either send an
> > > > > email message to a specific address or to add the comment to another page
> > > > > besides the one the tag is located upon.
> > > > >
> > > > > Thanks.
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > B.
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > On Jan 15, 2008 12:16 PM, Julius B. Lucks <julius at younglucks.com>
> > > > > wrote:
> > > > >
> > > > > >  Hey Mike,
> > > > > > Good points. An email comment/suggestion box would already be a
> > > > > > huge step forward, and might be the simplest thing to start off with.  We
> > > > > > can always reply to individual emails, and we can gradually evolve the
> > > > > > system into an email-based discussion board/list in the future.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > We can also start a wiki-based page, but given
> > > > > > how unwieldily long discussions are on the wiki, this might not be the best,
> > > > > > especially for a new user who is hesitant to edit the wiki.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Of course, in the presence of no user-feedback on which one is
> > > > > > best, we should do both!
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Cheers,
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Julius
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> > > > > > Please Reply to My Permanent Address: julius at younglucks.com
> > > > > > http://www.openwetware.org/wiki/User:Julius_B._Lucks
> > > > > > ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > On Jan 15, 2008, at 9:06 AM, M. Yee wrote:
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > This is a great idea, but how we implement feedback should
> > > > > > depend on what
> > > > > > we expect out of it. Email might be the easiest way to go, but
> > > > > > submitters
> > > > > >  would not necessarily be expecting a response--more of a
> > > > > > comment or
> > > > > > suggestion box in that case. If we're looking to start a
> > > > > > discussion with
> > > > > > the user, perhaps a thread similar to the "Help" page would be
> > > > > > useful.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Mike
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > On Tue, 15 Jan 2008, Julius B. Lucks wrote:
> > > > > >
> > > > > >  Hi SC,
> > > > > >
> > > > > > We really need some way for an average user to give feedback to
> > > > > > the SC about
> > > > > > how to make OWW better, how they currently use it, etc.   Outside
> > > > > > of the
> > > > > > survey, or someone finding the steering committee page on their
> > > > > > own, there is
> > > > > > really no mechanism to get general community feedback on how we
> > > > > > are doing, and
> > > > > > which direction we should take next.   I am hoping that as the
> > > > > > SC blog is used
> > > > > > more regularly, there will be useful comments on the posts, but
> > > > > > I don't think
> > > > > > that is enough.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > How about some sort of 'Feedback' link in the navigation bar?  That
> > > > > > way it can
> > > > > > be seen on every page so that people reaching OWW from Google
> > > > > > for example can
> > > > > > still give feedback.  The link ideally would point to some sort
> > > > > > of discussion
> > > > > > forum with topic threads etc., but for now should just bring up
> > > > > > some page that
> > > > > > a user could fill in to email feedback at openwetware.org for
> > > > > > example (email
> > > > > > being simpler for newer users than editing the wiki).
> > > > > >
> > > > > > What do you think?
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Cheers,
> > > > > >
> > > > > > Julius
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> > > > > > Please Reply to My Permanent Address: julius at younglucks.com
> > > > > > http://www.openwetware.org/wiki/User:Julius_B._Lucks
> > > > > >
> > > > > > ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > _______________________________________________
> > > > > > OpenWetWare Steering Committee Mailing List
> > > > > > sc at openwetware.org
> > > > > > http://mailman.mit.edu/mailman/listinfo/oww-sc
> > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> >
>
>
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From julius at younglucks.com  Wed Jan 16 14:14:31 2008
From: julius at younglucks.com (julius@younglucks.com)
Date: Wed, 16 Jan 2008 19:14:31 +0000
Subject: [OWW-SC] OWW User Feedback
In-Reply-To: <26428aaa0801160930y5dcd55a2yc786e7465a402b6e@mail.gmail.com>
References: <A5C64F68-0B0E-41DF-8C5B-6E5CD70AEB28@younglucks.com>
	<26428aaa0801151033q70fcd5c5tb9a0a16023359f1a@mail.gmail.com>
	<E44EDFE0-9A17-4FB1-A409-40CA453361D7@younglucks.com>
	<26428aaa0801151042x18b6c73fobf0da2a3675ec91c@mail.gmail.com>
	<26428aaa0801151049p73071415t113775abd1a98e31@mail.gmail.com>
	<4033D5B1-A57D-4BA4-87E7-767BA8C1868C@younglucks.com>
	<26428aaa0801151056i5c43c108wb922574b1357b950@mail.gmail.com>
	<F0F9FFC0-4366-4A23-A10C-5E002E228307@younglucks.com>
	<26428aaa0801151144u1c3f2337n906382412bdc89c6@mail.gmail.com>
	<067DA2C0-5BB3-4CB2-89C0-6B74BDB16CE6@younglucks.com>
	<26428aaa0801160930y5dcd55a2yc786e7465a402b6e@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <20080116191431.gp1ej3e9vpg0800c@webmail.younglucks.com>

Hey Bill,

What about this:

The text for the label to be used on the sidebar: Give Feedback

The text to be used in the Feedback page: Why not do a re-direct to  
the special page to reduce the number of clicks.  Then somewhere on  
the special page, make a link to the archive of all the feedback.

An icon to display next to it (see the "Community Portal, Materials,  
or Protocols for examples): Maybe some sort of pencil icon?

Let me know when it is live and I will do an sc blog post about it.

Quoting Bill F <bill.altmail at gmail.com>:

> Feedback is online.
>
> http://openwetware.org/index.php?title=Special:Contact
>
> I've set up the mailing list, forwarding mechanisms, email addresses, and a
> working email form to support OWW Feedback. The list and mail send support
> is online.
>
> Please note: There is still some additional information needed before the
> list is publicized at OWW. But the system is ready to roll. Follow the links
> in the OWW article referenced below to find the mailing list and add
> yourself to it.
>
> You can read about the details and get instructions on how to join the list
> here:
>
> http://openwetware.org/index.php?title=OpenWetWare:Software/Projects/Feedback
>
>
>
> On Jan 15, 2008 7:39 PM, Julius B. Lucks <julius at younglucks.com> wrote:
>
>> Can we have both - sending the comments to a mailing list, as well as
>> being posted on the wiki.  That way we can try out which one we like best.
>> I'll be happy to read the emails when the mailing list is set up.
>>
>> Cheers,
>>
>> Julius
>>
>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>> Please Reply to My Permanent Address: julius at younglucks.com
>> http://www.openwetware.org/wiki/User:Julius_B._Lucks
>>
>> ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>>
>>
>>
>> On Jan 15, 2008, at 11:44 AM, Bill F wrote:
>>
>> Here's an alternative that uses a technique Jason brought to my attention:
>>
>> http://openwetware.org/wiki/OpenWetWare:Feedback
>>
>> I need to get the correct mailing list name and it's done. We can clean it
>> up later but it will work as soon as I get the mailing list set up.
>>
>> As for where it is needs to be displayed, please let me know exactly where
>> you want me to put it.
>>
>> Thanks.
>>
>> B.
>>
>>
>>
>> On Jan 15, 2008 2:01 PM, Julius B. Lucks < julius at younglucks.com> wrote:
>>
>> > Sure - let's try it.
>> >
>> >   
>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>> > Please Reply to My Permanent Address: julius at younglucks.com
>> > http://www.openwetware.org/wiki/User:Julius_B._Lucks
>> >   
>> ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > On Jan 15, 2008, at 10:56 AM, Bill F wrote:
>> >
>> > I put a link on the page already But... I think it would be better to
>> > list the comments on the same page in this case.
>> >
>> > I can change the code so that the comment goes onto the page itself
>> > rather than onto the talk page.
>> >
>> > Tell me if that works. If so, I can have it turned on in a few minutes.
>> >
>> > B.
>> >
>> >
>> > On Jan 15, 2008 1:51 PM, Julius B. Lucks < julius at younglucks.com >
>> > wrote:
>> >
>> > > Wow,
>> > > That is excellent!  One thing - can we have a link to see all the
>> > > comments from  http://openwetware.org/wiki/OpenWetWare:Feedback -
>> > > right now there is only leave a comment, but you would not be   
>> able to see
>> > > all the comments if you don't leave one.
>> > >
>> > > J
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >   
>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>> > > Please Reply to My Permanent Address: julius at younglucks.com
>> > > http://www.openwetware.org/wiki/User:Julius_B._Lucks
>> > >   
>> ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >
>> > >
>> > > On Jan 15, 2008, at 10:49 AM, Bill F wrote:
>> > >
>> > > Take a look at this page:
>> > >
>> > > http://openwetware.org/wiki/OpenWetWare:Feedback
>> > >
>> > > I can add this to the toolbox when it does the right thing and looks
>> > > right.
>> > >
>> > >
>> > > On Jan 15, 2008 1:42 PM, Bill F <bill.altmail at gmail.com> wrote:
>> > >
>> > > > We can just create a page that has the tag in it and put a reference
>> > > > to the page in the toolbox for "Feedback".
>> > > >
>> > > > Anyone who wants to can put the Talk page in your Watchlist and
>> > > > receive email notifications when they are created.
>> > > >
>> > > > Again, it's "<comments /> and not <comment />.
>> > > >
>> > > > The syntax looks odd but it's XHTML compliant: the training  " />"
>> > > > saves you from creating an open and closing tag like this:
>> > > > <comments></comments>.
>> > > >
>> > > > Let me put a demo page together and send a link. You can put
>> > > > anything you want into the rest of the page you want to deliver.
>> > > >
>> > > > B.
>> > > >
>> > > >
>> > > >
>> > > >
>> > > > On Jan 15, 2008 1:37 PM, Julius B. Lucks < julius at younglucks.com>
>> > > > wrote:
>> > > >
>> > > > >  Hey Bill,
>> > > > > Would it be hard to make a link in the navigation bar that
>> > > > > inserted the <comment/> tag into the page that the user was viewing?
>> > > > >
>> > > > > Julius
>> > > > >
>> > > > >
>> > > > >   
>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>> > > > > Please Reply to My Permanent Address: julius at younglucks.com
>> > > > > http://www.openwetware.org/wiki/User:Julius_B._Lucks
>> > > > >   
>> ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>> > > > >
>> > > > >
>> > > > >
>> > > > >
>> > > > > On Jan 15, 2008, at 10:33 AM, Bill F wrote:
>> > > > >
>> > > > > I just downloaded and installed a comment tag that may be of use.
>> > > > >
>> > > > > To try it add the following tag to any OWW page:
>> > > > >
>> > > > > <comment />
>> > > > >
>> > > > > See what you think.
>> > > > >
>> > > > > This is a starting point. Ican change the code to either send an
>> > > > > email message to a specific address or to add the comment   
>> to another page
>> > > > > besides the one the tag is located upon.
>> > > > >
>> > > > > Thanks.
>> > > > >
>> > > > >
>> > > > > B.
>> > > > >
>> > > > >
>> > > > > On Jan 15, 2008 12:16 PM, Julius B. Lucks <julius at younglucks.com>
>> > > > > wrote:
>> > > > >
>> > > > > >  Hey Mike,
>> > > > > > Good points. An email comment/suggestion box would already be a
>> > > > > > huge step forward, and might be the simplest thing to   
>> start off with.  We
>> > > > > > can always reply to individual emails, and we can   
>> gradually evolve the
>> > > > > > system into an email-based discussion board/list in the future.
>> > > > > >
>> > > > > > We can also start a wiki-based page, but given
>> > > > > > how unwieldily long discussions are on the wiki, this   
>> might not be the best,
>> > > > > > especially for a new user who is hesitant to edit the wiki.
>> > > > > >
>> > > > > > Of course, in the presence of no user-feedback on which one is
>> > > > > > best, we should do both!
>> > > > > >
>> > > > > > Cheers,
>> > > > > >
>> > > > > > Julius
>> > > > > >
>> > > > > >
>> > > > > >   
>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>> > > > > > Please Reply to My Permanent Address: julius at younglucks.com
>> > > > > > http://www.openwetware.org/wiki/User:Julius_B._Lucks
>> > > > > >   
>> ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>> > > > > >
>> > > > > >
>> > > > > >
>> > > > > >
>> > > > > > On Jan 15, 2008, at 9:06 AM, M. Yee wrote:
>> > > > > >
>> > > > > >
>> > > > > > This is a great idea, but how we implement feedback should
>> > > > > > depend on what
>> > > > > > we expect out of it. Email might be the easiest way to go, but
>> > > > > > submitters
>> > > > > >  would not necessarily be expecting a response--more of a
>> > > > > > comment or
>> > > > > > suggestion box in that case. If we're looking to start a
>> > > > > > discussion with
>> > > > > > the user, perhaps a thread similar to the "Help" page would be
>> > > > > > useful.
>> > > > > >
>> > > > > > Mike
>> > > > > >
>> > > > > >
>> > > > > > On Tue, 15 Jan 2008, Julius B. Lucks wrote:
>> > > > > >
>> > > > > >  Hi SC,
>> > > > > >
>> > > > > > We really need some way for an average user to give feedback to
>> > > > > > the SC about
>> > > > > > how to make OWW better, how they currently use it, etc.   Outside
>> > > > > > of the
>> > > > > > survey, or someone finding the steering committee page on their
>> > > > > > own, there is
>> > > > > > really no mechanism to get general community feedback on how we
>> > > > > > are doing, and
>> > > > > > which direction we should take next.   I am hoping that as the
>> > > > > > SC blog is used
>> > > > > > more regularly, there will be useful comments on the posts, but
>> > > > > > I don't think
>> > > > > > that is enough.
>> > > > > >
>> > > > > > How about some sort of 'Feedback' link in the navigation   
>> bar?  That
>> > > > > > way it can
>> > > > > > be seen on every page so that people reaching OWW from Google
>> > > > > > for example can
>> > > > > > still give feedback.  The link ideally would point to some sort
>> > > > > > of discussion
>> > > > > > forum with topic threads etc., but for now should just bring up
>> > > > > > some page that
>> > > > > > a user could fill in to email feedback at openwetware.org for
>> > > > > > example (email
>> > > > > > being simpler for newer users than editing the wiki).
>> > > > > >
>> > > > > > What do you think?
>> > > > > >
>> > > > > > Cheers,
>> > > > > >
>> > > > > > Julius
>> > > > > >
>> > > > > >
>> > > > > >   
>> ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>> > > > > > Please Reply to My Permanent Address: julius at younglucks.com
>> > > > > > http://www.openwetware.org/wiki/User:Julius_B._Lucks
>> > > > > >
>> > > > > >   
>> ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>> > > > > >
>> > > > > >
>> > > > > >
>> > > > > >
>> > > > > >
>> > > > > > _______________________________________________
>> > > > > > OpenWetWare Steering Committee Mailing List
>> > > > > > sc at openwetware.org
>> > > > > > http://mailman.mit.edu/mailman/listinfo/oww-sc
>> > > > > >
>> > > > > >
>> > > > >
>> > > > >
>> > > >
>> > >
>> > >
>> >
>> >
>>
>>
>







From bill.altmail at gmail.com  Thu Jan 17 16:16:53 2008
From: bill.altmail at gmail.com (Bill F)
Date: Thu, 17 Jan 2008 16:16:53 -0500
Subject: [OWW-SC] New icons for OWW Feedback and Lab Notebook
Message-ID: <26428aaa0801171316q126b4e4cs514b7cb0a7130970@mail.gmail.com>

Jenny,

We need to come up with a few icons for OpenWetWare. I'd like some
advice/assistance from you when you have a chance. If anyone else has any
ideas, please let us know.

We need two of the tiny blue icons the same size as the house, lab beaker,
question mark, etc. that used are in the
navigation links on the left hand side of all wiki pages.

"Donate" will be under the "Random page" item.
"Feedback" will be the last item, just under donate. If we had a larger
version of the same icon available, I can include it on the page.

Any suggestions on what to use for these items?

We also would like to come up with a set of icons/graphics for the Lab
Notebook. We have three levels in the lab notebook:

Main Lab Notebook
Project
Entry

We can use consistent icons on all pages or use variations for the main
level, the project view, and the entry (date) view.

Let me know what you all think about how this might work.


Thanks.


Bill Flanagan
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From bill.altmail at gmail.com  Fri Jan 18 18:46:59 2008
From: bill.altmail at gmail.com (Bill F)
Date: Fri, 18 Jan 2008 18:46:59 -0500
Subject: [OWW-SC] Fwd: [Oww-Feedback] Feedback Message (from Dr Alejo
	Corrales)
In-Reply-To: <20080118214404.9D85E3D2033@mail.openwetware.org>
References: <20080118214404.9D85E3D2033@mail.openwetware.org>
Message-ID: <26428aaa0801181546m435e2d8cp48c7735a0ec533ef@mail.gmail.com>

We have our first feedback message. I can't figure out what to do with it so
you folks can decide.

I added links and icons for feedback and donate to the navigator menu. Both
links are now active.

I'll add a way to edit the message for Feedback when I have a chance.

Thanks.

Bill


---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: OpenWetWare Feedback Form on OpenWetWare <feedback at openwetware.org>
Date: Jan 18, 2008 4:44 PM
Subject: [Oww-Feedback] Feedback Message (from Dr Alejo Corrales)
To: Oww-Feedback <feedback at openwetware.org>


Dear Dr Berglund: My name is Dr. Alejo Corrales from Argentina. The reason
of this email , is because I would like know about new myotonic dystrophies
(Steinert disease) therapies  . My sister in law is affected , She had a
baby who died 27 days after she birth . at this moment we realized that my
sister in law family was carrier of the mutation , she has several relatives
whose died as cause of this disease. My sister in law father   is 72 years
old he is carrier , he is affected  , he is still alive but he shows several
signs of the sateinet disease . Currently, my sister in law has same symtoms
of the disease sach as myotonia. hypersomnia , Bronchitis among others. we
are looking for new strategies o experimental treatments for this disease. I
will apretiate if you can colaborate with same information we are able to go
overseas if it is necesary.

Best regards

Dr. Alejo Corrales
Ecuador 1334 3A
Capital Federal
Buenos Aires
Argentina
CP1425
1550985600
_______________________________________________
Oww-Feedback mailing list
Oww-Feedback at mit.edu
http://mailman.mit.edu/mailman/listinfo/oww-feedback
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From julius at younglucks.com  Fri Jan 18 19:02:53 2008
From: julius at younglucks.com (Julius B. Lucks)
Date: Fri, 18 Jan 2008 16:02:53 -0800
Subject: [OWW-SC] Fwd: [Oww-Feedback] Feedback Message (from Dr Alejo
	Corrales)
In-Reply-To: <26428aaa0801181546m435e2d8cp48c7735a0ec533ef@mail.gmail.com>
References: <20080118214404.9D85E3D2033@mail.openwetware.org>
	<26428aaa0801181546m435e2d8cp48c7735a0ec533ef@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <AD9E855B-3165-4A2A-B3C8-A0D44BF6FA9E@younglucks.com>

Is Dr. Berglund a user?  It kind of looks like spam.

Julius

Please Reply to julius at younglucks.com

On Jan 18, 2008, at 3:46 PM, "Bill F" <bill.altmail at gmail.com> wrote:

> We have our first feedback message. I can't figure out what to do  
> with it so you folks can decide.
>
> I added links and icons for feedback and donate to the navigator  
> menu. Both links are now active.
>
> I'll add a way to edit the message for Feedback when I have a chance.
>
> Thanks.
>
> Bill
>
>
> ---------- Forwarded message ----------
> From: OpenWetWare Feedback Form on OpenWetWare < feedback at openwetware.org 
> >
> Date: Jan 18, 2008 4:44 PM
> Subject: [Oww-Feedback] Feedback Message (from Dr Alejo Corrales)
> To: Oww-Feedback <feedback at openwetware.org >
>
>
> Dear Dr Berglund: My name is Dr. Alejo Corrales from Argentina. The  
> reason of this email , is because I would like know about new  
> myotonic dystrophies (Steinert disease) therapies  . My sister in  
> law is affected , She had a baby who died 27 days after she birth .  
> at this moment we realized that my sister in law family was carrier  
> of the mutation , she has several relatives whose died as cause of  
> this disease. My sister in law father   is 72 years old he is  
> carrier , he is affected  , he is still alive but he shows several  
> signs of the sateinet disease . Currently, my sister in law has same  
> symtoms of the disease sach as myotonia. hypersomnia , Bronchitis  
> among others. we are looking for new strategies o experimental  
> treatments for this disease. I will apretiate if you can colaborate  
> with same information we are able to go overseas if it is necesary.
>
> Best regards
>
> Dr. Alejo Corrales
> Ecuador 1334 3A
> Capital Federal
> Buenos Aires
> Argentina
> CP1425
> 1550985600
> _______________________________________________
> Oww-Feedback mailing list
> Oww-Feedback at mit.edu
> http://mailman.mit.edu/mailman/listinfo/oww-feedback
>
> _______________________________________________
> OpenWetWare Steering Committee Mailing List
> sc at openwetware.org
> http://mailman.mit.edu/mailman/listinfo/oww-sc
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From austin at csail.mit.edu  Fri Jan 18 19:16:09 2008
From: austin at csail.mit.edu (Austin Che)
Date: Fri, 18 Jan 2008 19:16:09 -0500
Subject: [OWW-SC] Fwd: [Oww-Feedback] Feedback Message (from Dr Alejo
	Corrales)
In-Reply-To: <AD9E855B-3165-4A2A-B3C8-A0D44BF6FA9E@younglucks.com> (Julius
	B. Lucks's message of "Fri, 18 Jan 2008 16:02:53 -0800")
References: <20080118214404.9D85E3D2033@mail.openwetware.org>
	<26428aaa0801181546m435e2d8cp48c7735a0ec533ef@mail.gmail.com>
	<AD9E855B-3165-4A2A-B3C8-A0D44BF6FA9E@younglucks.com>
Message-ID: <874pda3c1i.fsf@nitsua.mit.edu>


> Is Dr. Berglund a user?  It kind of looks like spam.

    http://openwetware.org/wiki/Berglund
    Dr. Alejo Corrales from http://www.ipbi.com.ar/staff.htm

    It does bring up the point that people browsing around may not
    realize the feedback button on the left isn't for the lab page
    they're looking at.

-- 
Austin Che           <austin at csail.mit.edu>          (617)253-5899


From tk at csail.mit.edu  Fri Jan 18 19:22:29 2008
From: tk at csail.mit.edu (Tom Knight)
Date: Fri, 18 Jan 2008 19:22:29 -0500
Subject: [OWW-SC] Fwd: [Oww-Feedback] Feedback Message (from Dr Alejo
	Corrales)
In-Reply-To: <26428aaa0801181546m435e2d8cp48c7735a0ec533ef@mail.gmail.com>
References: <20080118214404.9D85E3D2033@mail.openwetware.org>
	<26428aaa0801181546m435e2d8cp48c7735a0ec533ef@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <8d6c9c85467de72a977e17f2d5de9f56@csail.mit.edu>

Apparently we need a statement similar to this one in the Pubmed FAQ:
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query/static/faq.html


On Jan 18, 2008, at 6:46 PM, Bill F wrote:

> We have our first feedback message. I can't figure out what to do with 
> it so you folks can decide.
>
> I added links and icons for feedback and donate to the navigator menu. 
> Both links are now active.
>
> I'll add a way to edit the message for Feedback when I have a chance.
>
> Thanks.
>
> Bill
>
>
> ---------- Forwarded message ----------
> From: OpenWetWare Feedback Form on OpenWetWare < 
> feedback at openwetware.org>
> Date: Jan 18, 2008 4:44 PM
> Subject: [Oww-Feedback] Feedback Message (from Dr Alejo Corrales)
> To: Oww-Feedback <feedback at openwetware.org >
>
>
> Dear Dr Berglund: My name is Dr. Alejo Corrales from Argentina. The 
> reason of this email , is because I would like know about new myotonic 
> dystrophies (Steinert disease) therapies ?. My sister in law is 
> affected , She had a baby who died 27 days after she birth . at this 
> moment we realized that my sister in law family was carrier of the 
> mutation , she has several relatives whose died as cause of this 
> disease. My sister in law father ? is 72 years old he is carrier , he 
> is affected ?, he is still alive but he shows several signs of the 
> sateinet disease . Currently, my sister in law has same symtoms of the 
> disease sach as myotonia. hypersomnia , Bronchitis among others. we 
> are looking for new strategies o experimental treatments for this 
> disease. I will apretiate if you can colaborate with same information 
> we are able to go overseas if it is necesary.
>
> Best regards
>
> Dr. Alejo Corrales
> Ecuador 1334 3A
> Capital Federal
> Buenos Aires
> Argentina
> CP1425
> 1550985600
> _______________________________________________
> Oww-Feedback mailing list
> Oww-Feedback at mit.edu
> http://mailman.mit.edu/mailman/listinfo/oww-feedback
>
> _______________________________________________
> OpenWetWare Steering Committee Mailing List
> sc at openwetware.org
> http://mailman.mit.edu/mailman/listinfo/oww-sc
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From austin at csail.mit.edu  Fri Jan 18 19:41:25 2008
From: austin at csail.mit.edu (Austin Che)
Date: Fri, 18 Jan 2008 19:41:25 -0500
Subject: [OWW-SC] Fwd: [Oww-Feedback] Feedback Message (from Dr Alejo
	Corrales)
In-Reply-To: <8d6c9c85467de72a977e17f2d5de9f56@csail.mit.edu> (Tom Knight's
	message of "Fri, 18 Jan 2008 19:22:29 -0500")
References: <20080118214404.9D85E3D2033@mail.openwetware.org>
	<26428aaa0801181546m435e2d8cp48c7735a0ec533ef@mail.gmail.com>
	<8d6c9c85467de72a977e17f2d5de9f56@csail.mit.edu>
Message-ID: <87hcha8x56.fsf@nitsua.mit.edu>


    I think we need a way for anyone to email someone on the wiki. For
    example, make this work for non-logged in users.   
    http://openwetware.org/wiki/Special:Emailuser/Austin_J._Che

    Or allow the creation of the feedback forms that send to arbitrary
    email addresses from the wiki.

    Looking around the Berglund lab page, I couldn't find any other
    way of contacting them.

> Apparently we need a statement similar to this one in the Pubmed FAQ:
> http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query/static/faq.html
>
> On Jan 18, 2008, at 6:46 PM, Bill F wrote:
>
> We have our first feedback message. I can't figure out what to do with
> it so you folks can decide.

-- 
Austin Che           <austin at csail.mit.edu>          (617)253-5899


From ilyas at MIT.EDU  Fri Jan 18 20:07:32 2008
From: ilyas at MIT.EDU (Ilya Sytchev)
Date: Fri, 18 Jan 2008 20:07:32 -0500
Subject: [OWW-SC] Fwd: [Oww-Feedback] Feedback Message (from Dr Alejo
 Corrales)
In-Reply-To: <87hcha8x56.fsf@nitsua.mit.edu>
References: <20080118214404.9D85E3D2033@mail.openwetware.org>	<26428aaa0801181546m435e2d8cp48c7735a0ec533ef@mail.gmail.com>	<8d6c9c85467de72a977e17f2d5de9f56@csail.mit.edu>
	<87hcha8x56.fsf@nitsua.mit.edu>
Message-ID: <47914D54.2040203@mit.edu>

Yes but allowing anonymous emailing is tricky because it's easy to open 
the site to spam.  I think the first approach would do that for sure. 
In the second method the users would have to manually create the form 
which puts additional burden on them.


Austin Che wrote:
>     I think we need a way for anyone to email someone on the wiki. For
>     example, make this work for non-logged in users.   
>     http://openwetware.org/wiki/Special:Emailuser/Austin_J._Che
> 
>     Or allow the creation of the feedback forms that send to arbitrary
>     email addresses from the wiki.
> 
>     Looking around the Berglund lab page, I couldn't find any other
>     way of contacting them.
> 
>> Apparently we need a statement similar to this one in the Pubmed FAQ:
>> http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query/static/faq.html
>>
>> On Jan 18, 2008, at 6:46 PM, Bill F wrote:
>>
>> We have our first feedback message. I can't figure out what to do with
>> it so you folks can decide.
> 


From julius at younglucks.com  Fri Jan 18 21:53:45 2008
From: julius at younglucks.com (julius@younglucks.com)
Date: Sat, 19 Jan 2008 02:53:45 +0000
Subject: [OWW-SC] Fwd: [Oww-Feedback] Feedback Message (from Dr
	Alejo	Corrales)
In-Reply-To: <8d6c9c85467de72a977e17f2d5de9f56@csail.mit.edu>
References: <20080118214404.9D85E3D2033@mail.openwetware.org>
	<26428aaa0801181546m435e2d8cp48c7735a0ec533ef@mail.gmail.com>
	<8d6c9c85467de72a977e17f2d5de9f56@csail.mit.edu>
Message-ID: <20080119025345.8y8rn3ct6zwgwg4o@webmail.younglucks.com>

Bill, Mac and I have started working on HOWTO pages:

http://openwetware.org/wiki/Help:HOWTO

Vincent and I have it as an outreach task to expand the number of  
topics, but anyone feel free to help us out.  See the talk page for a  
list of requested topics to fill out, and just copy the format of the  
current articles.

Julius


Quoting Tom Knight <tk at csail.mit.edu>:

> Apparently we need a statement similar to this one in the Pubmed FAQ:
> http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query/static/faq.html
>
>
> On Jan 18, 2008, at 6:46 PM, Bill F wrote:
>
>> We have our first feedback message. I can't figure out what to do   
>> with it so you folks can decide.
>>
>> I added links and icons for feedback and donate to the navigator   
>> menu. Both links are now active.
>>
>> I'll add a way to edit the message for Feedback when I have a chance.
>>
>> Thanks.
>>
>> Bill
>>
>>
>> ---------- Forwarded message ----------
>> From: OpenWetWare Feedback Form on OpenWetWare < feedback at openwetware.org>
>> Date: Jan 18, 2008 4:44 PM
>> Subject: [Oww-Feedback] Feedback Message (from Dr Alejo Corrales)
>> To: Oww-Feedback <feedback at openwetware.org >
>>
>>
>> Dear Dr Berglund: My name is Dr. Alejo Corrales from Argentina. The  
>>  reason of this email , is because I would like know about new   
>> myotonic dystrophies (Steinert disease) therapies  . My sister in   
>> law is affected , She had a baby who died 27 days after she birth .  
>>  at this moment we realized that my sister in law family was  
>> carrier  of the mutation , she has several relatives whose died as  
>> cause of  this disease. My sister in law father   is 72 years old  
>> he is  carrier , he is affected  , he is still alive but he shows  
>> several  signs of the sateinet disease . Currently, my sister in  
>> law has  same symtoms of the disease sach as myotonia. hypersomnia  
>> ,  Bronchitis among others. we are looking for new strategies o   
>> experimental treatments for this disease. I will apretiate if you   
>> can colaborate with same information we are able to go overseas if   
>> it is necesary.
>>
>> Best regards
>>
>> Dr. Alejo Corrales
>> Ecuador 1334 3A
>> Capital Federal
>> Buenos Aires
>> Argentina
>> CP1425
>> 1550985600
>> _______________________________________________
>> Oww-Feedback mailing list
>> Oww-Feedback at mit.edu
>> http://mailman.mit.edu/mailman/listinfo/oww-feedback
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> OpenWetWare Steering Committee Mailing List
>> sc at openwetware.org
>> http://mailman.mit.edu/mailman/listinfo/oww-sc







From julius at younglucks.com  Fri Jan 18 21:56:47 2008
From: julius at younglucks.com (julius@younglucks.com)
Date: Sat, 19 Jan 2008 02:56:47 +0000
Subject: [OWW-SC] Fwd: [Oww-Feedback] Feedback Message (from Dr
	Alejo	Corrales)
In-Reply-To: <87hcha8x56.fsf@nitsua.mit.edu>
References: <20080118214404.9D85E3D2033@mail.openwetware.org>
	<26428aaa0801181546m435e2d8cp48c7735a0ec533ef@mail.gmail.com>
	<8d6c9c85467de72a977e17f2d5de9f56@csail.mit.edu>
	<87hcha8x56.fsf@nitsua.mit.edu>
Message-ID: <20080119025647.dja7d98gsn40ssos@webmail.younglucks.com>

What about the content of emails being sent to the user talk page  
instead of emailing them?  Either way, we may run into a spam issue.   
We also might allow anyone to edit a user talk page for messaging as  
an alternative.

In any case, I will email the 1st feedback user with instructions on  
how to contact an individual user.

Cheers,

Julius

Quoting Austin Che <austin at csail.mit.edu>:

>
>     I think we need a way for anyone to email someone on the wiki. For
>     example, make this work for non-logged in users.
>     http://openwetware.org/wiki/Special:Emailuser/Austin_J._Che
>
>     Or allow the creation of the feedback forms that send to arbitrary
>     email addresses from the wiki.
>
>     Looking around the Berglund lab page, I couldn't find any other
>     way of contacting them.
>
>> Apparently we need a statement similar to this one in the Pubmed FAQ:
>> http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query/static/faq.html
>>
>> On Jan 18, 2008, at 6:46 PM, Bill F wrote:
>>
>> We have our first feedback message. I can't figure out what to do with
>> it so you folks can decide.
>
> --
> Austin Che           <austin at csail.mit.edu>          (617)253-5899
> _______________________________________________
> OpenWetWare Steering Committee Mailing List
> sc at openwetware.org
> http://mailman.mit.edu/mailman/listinfo/oww-sc
>







From jasonk at MIT.EDU  Fri Jan 18 22:11:47 2008
From: jasonk at MIT.EDU (Jason Kelly)
Date: Fri, 18 Jan 2008 22:11:47 -0500
Subject: [OWW-SC] Fwd: [Oww-Feedback] Feedback Message (from Dr Alejo
	Corrales)
In-Reply-To: <20080119025647.dja7d98gsn40ssos@webmail.younglucks.com>
References: <20080118214404.9D85E3D2033@mail.openwetware.org>
	<26428aaa0801181546m435e2d8cp48c7735a0ec533ef@mail.gmail.com>
	<8d6c9c85467de72a977e17f2d5de9f56@csail.mit.edu>
	<87hcha8x56.fsf@nitsua.mit.edu>
	<20080119025647.dja7d98gsn40ssos@webmail.younglucks.com>
Message-ID: <7c085c480801181911h63112c3aq8257c55d9a2c7f1@mail.gmail.com>

I think we might want to tread carefully on this one.  i assume this
researcher's (Dr. Berglund) contact info is available through his
school somehow...could suggest the person who emailed check there.

i wouldn't recommend to the person who emailed that he get an OWW
account and then start posting on talk pages or anything.  we need to
be a little protective of community, i think.  This guy isn't a
biologist or biological engineer doing research -- he's looking for
medical advice.  And there are much better places for him to find
that.

Austin, I'm against the email form for users.  If someone wants to get
random emails, they'll post their contact info.  We already allow
within-OWW form emailing, which I think covers most bases.  Having a
pre-requisite of signing up to OWW being that everyone on the internet
gets to know your email address (even if it's through a form) is too
much to ask, IMO.

thanks,
jason

On Jan 18, 2008 9:56 PM,  <julius at younglucks.com> wrote:
> What about the content of emails being sent to the user talk page
> instead of emailing them?  Either way, we may run into a spam issue.
> We also might allow anyone to edit a user talk page for messaging as
> an alternative.
>
> In any case, I will email the 1st feedback user with instructions on
> how to contact an individual user.
>
> Cheers,
>
> Julius
>
>
> Quoting Austin Che <austin at csail.mit.edu>:
>
> >
> >     I think we need a way for anyone to email someone on the wiki. For
> >     example, make this work for non-logged in users.
> >     http://openwetware.org/wiki/Special:Emailuser/Austin_J._Che
> >
> >     Or allow the creation of the feedback forms that send to arbitrary
> >     email addresses from the wiki.
> >
> >     Looking around the Berglund lab page, I couldn't find any other
> >     way of contacting them.
> >
> >> Apparently we need a statement similar to this one in the Pubmed FAQ:
> >> http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query/static/faq.html
> >>
> >> On Jan 18, 2008, at 6:46 PM, Bill F wrote:
> >>
> >> We have our first feedback message. I can't figure out what to do with
> >> it so you folks can decide.
> >
> > --
> > Austin Che           <austin at csail.mit.edu>          (617)253-5899
> > _______________________________________________
> > OpenWetWare Steering Committee Mailing List
> > sc at openwetware.org
> > http://mailman.mit.edu/mailman/listinfo/oww-sc
> >
>
>
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> OpenWetWare Steering Committee Mailing List
> sc at openwetware.org
> http://mailman.mit.edu/mailman/listinfo/oww-sc
>


From bill.altmail at gmail.com  Sat Jan 19 08:54:37 2008
From: bill.altmail at gmail.com (Bill F)
Date: Sat, 19 Jan 2008 08:54:37 -0500
Subject: [OWW-SC] Fwd: [Oww-Feedback] Feedback Message (from Dr Alejo
	Corrales)
In-Reply-To: <20080119025345.8y8rn3ct6zwgwg4o@webmail.younglucks.com>
References: <20080118214404.9D85E3D2033@mail.openwetware.org>
	<26428aaa0801181546m435e2d8cp48c7735a0ec533ef@mail.gmail.com>
	<8d6c9c85467de72a977e17f2d5de9f56@csail.mit.edu>
	<20080119025345.8y8rn3ct6zwgwg4o@webmail.younglucks.com>
Message-ID: <26428aaa0801190554g165853cbv298fb78019fb69d1@mail.gmail.com>

Julius,

This is great. Should we suggest that people willing to do one make a note
on the list so that other people know that it's in-progress?

Thanks for pushing this one forward!


Bill



On Jan 18, 2008 9:53 PM, <julius at younglucks.com> wrote:

> Bill, Mac and I have started working on HOWTO pages:
>
> http://openwetware.org/wiki/Help:HOWTO
>
> Vincent and I have it as an outreach task to expand the number of
> topics, but anyone feel free to help us out.  See the talk page for a
> list of requested topics to fill out, and just copy the format of the
> current articles.
>
> Julius
>
>
> Quoting Tom Knight <tk at csail.mit.edu>:
>
> > Apparently we need a statement similar to this one in the Pubmed FAQ:
> > http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query/static/faq.html
> >
> >
> > On Jan 18, 2008, at 6:46 PM, Bill F wrote:
> >
> >> We have our first feedback message. I can't figure out what to do
> >> with it so you folks can decide.
> >>
> >> I added links and icons for feedback and donate to the navigator
> >> menu. Both links are now active.
> >>
> >> I'll add a way to edit the message for Feedback when I have a chance.
> >>
> >> Thanks.
> >>
> >> Bill
> >>
> >>
> >> ---------- Forwarded message ----------
> >> From: OpenWetWare Feedback Form on OpenWetWare <
> feedback at openwetware.org>
> >> Date: Jan 18, 2008 4:44 PM
> >> Subject: [Oww-Feedback] Feedback Message (from Dr Alejo Corrales)
> >> To: Oww-Feedback <feedback at openwetware.org >
> >>
> >>
> >> Dear Dr Berglund: My name is Dr. Alejo Corrales from Argentina. The
> >>  reason of this email , is because I would like know about new
> >> myotonic dystrophies (Steinert disease) therapies  . My sister in
> >> law is affected , She had a baby who died 27 days after she birth .
> >>  at this moment we realized that my sister in law family was
> >> carrier  of the mutation , she has several relatives whose died as
> >> cause of  this disease. My sister in law father   is 72 years old
> >> he is  carrier , he is affected  , he is still alive but he shows
> >> several  signs of the sateinet disease . Currently, my sister in
> >> law has  same symtoms of the disease sach as myotonia. hypersomnia
> >> ,  Bronchitis among others. we are looking for new strategies o
> >> experimental treatments for this disease. I will apretiate if you
> >> can colaborate with same information we are able to go overseas if
> >> it is necesary.
> >>
> >> Best regards
> >>
> >> Dr. Alejo Corrales
> >> Ecuador 1334 3A
> >> Capital Federal
> >> Buenos Aires
> >> Argentina
> >> CP1425
> >> 1550985600
> >> _______________________________________________
> >> Oww-Feedback mailing list
> >> Oww-Feedback at mit.edu
> >> http://mailman.mit.edu/mailman/listinfo/oww-feedback
> >>
> >> _______________________________________________
> >> OpenWetWare Steering Committee Mailing List
> >> sc at openwetware.org
> >> http://mailman.mit.edu/mailman/listinfo/oww-sc
>
>
>
>
>
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From bill.altmail at gmail.com  Sat Jan 19 09:42:03 2008
From: bill.altmail at gmail.com (Bill F)
Date: Sat, 19 Jan 2008 09:42:03 -0500
Subject: [OWW-SC] Fwd: [Oww-Feedback] Feedback Message (from Dr Alejo
	Corrales)
In-Reply-To: <7c085c480801181911h63112c3aq8257c55d9a2c7f1@mail.gmail.com>
References: <20080118214404.9D85E3D2033@mail.openwetware.org>
	<26428aaa0801181546m435e2d8cp48c7735a0ec533ef@mail.gmail.com>
	<8d6c9c85467de72a977e17f2d5de9f56@csail.mit.edu>
	<87hcha8x56.fsf@nitsua.mit.edu>
	<20080119025647.dja7d98gsn40ssos@webmail.younglucks.com>
	<7c085c480801181911h63112c3aq8257c55d9a2c7f1@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <26428aaa0801190642ocbb4af0k5b6e4c31c3116066@mail.gmail.com>

The email address for Berglund, the intended recipient, is available on his
website. That website appears in the Google search results list as number 3
on the list of results for his own lab. OpenWetWare is listed as number 1
and 2. This won't be the last time someone considers us a definitive source
for getting connected to another person.

In Dec, 2007, Berglund published an article in RNA Journal that may be the
reason the emailer is trying to reach out to him. The name of the emailer
appears on the speakers list of 2 medical conferences in his location.

We should make a policy about this. I agree. But I would advise routing the
message to its intended recipient. I can provide the email address
information if needed.

B.



On Jan 18, 2008 10:11 PM, Jason Kelly <jasonk at mit.edu> wrote:

> I think we might want to tread carefully on this one.  i assume this
> researcher's (Dr. Berglund) contact info is available through his
> school somehow...could suggest the person who emailed check there.
>
> i wouldn't recommend to the person who emailed that he get an OWW
> account and then start posting on talk pages or anything.  we need to
> be a little protective of community, i think.  This guy isn't a
> biologist or biological engineer doing research -- he's looking for
> medical advice.  And there are much better places for him to find
> that.
>
> Austin, I'm against the email form for users.  If someone wants to get
> random emails, they'll post their contact info.  We already allow
> within-OWW form emailing, which I think covers most bases.  Having a
> pre-requisite of signing up to OWW being that everyone on the internet
> gets to know your email address (even if it's through a form) is too
> much to ask, IMO.
>
> thanks,
> jason
>
> On Jan 18, 2008 9:56 PM,  <julius at younglucks.com> wrote:
> > What about the content of emails being sent to the user talk page
> > instead of emailing them?  Either way, we may run into a spam issue.
> > We also might allow anyone to edit a user talk page for messaging as
> > an alternative.
> >
> > In any case, I will email the 1st feedback user with instructions on
> > how to contact an individual user.
> >
> > Cheers,
> >
> > Julius
> >
> >
> > Quoting Austin Che <austin at csail.mit.edu>:
> >
> > >
> > >     I think we need a way for anyone to email someone on the wiki. For
> > >     example, make this work for non-logged in users.
> > >     http://openwetware.org/wiki/Special:Emailuser/Austin_J._Che
> > >
> > >     Or allow the creation of the feedback forms that send to arbitrary
> > >     email addresses from the wiki.
> > >
> > >     Looking around the Berglund lab page, I couldn't find any other
> > >     way of contacting them.
> > >
> > >> Apparently we need a statement similar to this one in the Pubmed FAQ:
> > >> http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query/static/faq.html
> > >>
> > >> On Jan 18, 2008, at 6:46 PM, Bill F wrote:
> > >>
> > >> We have our first feedback message. I can't figure out what to do
> with
> > >> it so you folks can decide.
> > >
> > > --
> > > Austin Che           <austin at csail.mit.edu>          (617)253-5899
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > OpenWetWare Steering Committee Mailing List
> > > sc at openwetware.org
> > > http://mailman.mit.edu/mailman/listinfo/oww-sc
> > >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > OpenWetWare Steering Committee Mailing List
> > sc at openwetware.org
> > http://mailman.mit.edu/mailman/listinfo/oww-sc
> >
> _______________________________________________
> OpenWetWare Steering Committee Mailing List
> sc at openwetware.org
> http://mailman.mit.edu/mailman/listinfo/oww-sc
>
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From bill.altmail at gmail.com  Sat Jan 19 10:42:07 2008
From: bill.altmail at gmail.com (Bill F)
Date: Sat, 19 Jan 2008 10:42:07 -0500
Subject: [OWW-SC] Changes to Feedback based upon "preliminary feedback"
Message-ID: <26428aaa0801190742m18168a10o545d97194412f5be@mail.gmail.com>

I've made a few changes to the way feedback messages are handled to tighten
up the accepting and distribution of those messages.

1. The System:Contact special page is pretty cool. Feedback is collected
from the "feedback form" and delivered to an unpublished email address. We
can accept any feedback via the website and handle it as we need to.

2. I have created a new email alias on OpenWetWare.org to serve as the
destination for the feedback messages. This address is a random sequence and
will not generally be published.

3. I removed the "feedback" alias from OpenWetWare.org. All messages to be
routed to the Oww-Feedback.mit.edu mailing list will go to the new mail
address.

4. If people find and abuse the "oww-feedback at mit.edu" address badly, we'll
fall back the same way by renaming the list or replacing it with an app
within OWW or via another web application.

5. In any discussion of feedback within OWW, please refrain from writing
actual email addresses. This will keep the robots from finding and spamming
the list.

6. Anyone on the current OWW-Feedback list will notice no difference in its
behavior. The random email address I mentioned is part of the "feedback
application" and wasn't intended as an alternate way of submitting
feedback.

7. I am adding a new MediaWiki: system message,
"MediaWiki:FeedbackHeaderContent". The contents of this message will be
displayed on the form. I'll let people know when it's available.

Let's see how this works. We can use it for other processes which involve
taking input from non-OWW members in a controlled manner as they emerge.

Thanks.

Bill
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From rshetty at MIT.EDU  Sat Jan 19 12:12:27 2008
From: rshetty at MIT.EDU (Reshma Shetty)
Date: Sat, 19 Jan 2008 12:12:27 -0500
Subject: [OWW-SC] Fwd: [Oww-Feedback] Feedback Message (from Dr Alejo
	Corrales)
In-Reply-To: <7c085c480801181911h63112c3aq8257c55d9a2c7f1@mail.gmail.com>
References: <20080118214404.9D85E3D2033@mail.openwetware.org>
	<26428aaa0801181546m435e2d8cp48c7735a0ec533ef@mail.gmail.com>
	<8d6c9c85467de72a977e17f2d5de9f56@csail.mit.edu>
	<87hcha8x56.fsf@nitsua.mit.edu>
	<20080119025647.dja7d98gsn40ssos@webmail.younglucks.com>
	<7c085c480801181911h63112c3aq8257c55d9a2c7f1@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <6e9f40380801190912l5aada446w7605813f6bfe9a33@mail.gmail.com>

Hi all,

In response to Tom's suggestion, I've updated the OWW disclaime
http://openwetware.org/wiki/OpenWetWare:General_disclaimer
Please feel free to amend.

I think the mechanism for easier feedback to OWW is great.  (Props to Julius
for suggesting it and Bill for deploying it so quickly).  But I do agree
with Jason that OWW should not provide a general mechanism for people
without OWW accounts to contact OWW members.  I think OWW users,
specifically occasional users, could become quickly turned off by a site
that enabled them to get spammed.  Especially since people are probably
likely to use their "real" email address to register with OWW rather than
their "spam" webmail address.

I'm also pretty wary of allowing anonymous posts to user talk pages.  I
think it just invites wiki spam and most OWW users including myself don't
want to have to deal with clearing spam even from just their user talk
page.  (Based on wikiomics' experience, it can be pretty easy for the spam
engines to bury pages in links to britney spears pics.)

Personally, I'd prefer to continue with the feedback system as an email form
which anyone can use.  We can relay messages to the intended recipient as
needed.  If this option becomes untenable (i.e. a flood of messages not re
OWW but re individual pages), then we can reassess.

Just my two cents.

Thanks,

Reshma

On Jan 18, 2008 10:11 PM, Jason Kelly <jasonk at mit.edu> wrote:

> I think we might want to tread carefully on this one.  i assume this
> researcher's (Dr. Berglund) contact info is available through his
> school somehow...could suggest the person who emailed check there.
>
> i wouldn't recommend to the person who emailed that he get an OWW
> account and then start posting on talk pages or anything.  we need to
> be a little protective of community, i think.  This guy isn't a
> biologist or biological engineer doing research -- he's looking for
> medical advice.  And there are much better places for him to find
> that.
>
> Austin, I'm against the email form for users.  If someone wants to get
> random emails, they'll post their contact info.  We already allow
> within-OWW form emailing, which I think covers most bases.  Having a
> pre-requisite of signing up to OWW being that everyone on the internet
> gets to know your email address (even if it's through a form) is too
> much to ask, IMO.
>
> thanks,
> jason
>
> On Jan 18, 2008 9:56 PM,  <julius at younglucks.com> wrote:
> > What about the content of emails being sent to the user talk page
> > instead of emailing them?  Either way, we may run into a spam issue.
> > We also might allow anyone to edit a user talk page for messaging as
> > an alternative.
> >
> > In any case, I will email the 1st feedback user with instructions on
> > how to contact an individual user.
> >
> > Cheers,
> >
> > Julius
> >
> >
> > Quoting Austin Che <austin at csail.mit.edu>:
> >
> > >
> > >     I think we need a way for anyone to email someone on the wiki. For
> > >     example, make this work for non-logged in users.
> > >     http://openwetware.org/wiki/Special:Emailuser/Austin_J._Che
> > >
> > >     Or allow the creation of the feedback forms that send to arbitrary
> > >     email addresses from the wiki.
> > >
> > >     Looking around the Berglund lab page, I couldn't find any other
> > >     way of contacting them.
> > >
> > >> Apparently we need a statement similar to this one in the Pubmed FAQ:
> > >> http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query/static/faq.html
> > >>
> > >> On Jan 18, 2008, at 6:46 PM, Bill F wrote:
> > >>
> > >> We have our first feedback message. I can't figure out what to do
> with
> > >> it so you folks can decide.
> > >
> > > --
> > > Austin Che           <austin at csail.mit.edu>          (617)253-5899
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > OpenWetWare Steering Committee Mailing List
> > > sc at openwetware.org
> > > http://mailman.mit.edu/mailman/listinfo/oww-sc
> > >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > OpenWetWare Steering Committee Mailing List
> > sc at openwetware.org
> > http://mailman.mit.edu/mailman/listinfo/oww-sc
> >
> _______________________________________________
> OpenWetWare Steering Committee Mailing List
> sc at openwetware.org
> http://mailman.mit.edu/mailman/listinfo/oww-sc
>
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From bill.altmail at gmail.com  Sat Jan 19 12:23:21 2008
From: bill.altmail at gmail.com (Bill F)
Date: Sat, 19 Jan 2008 12:23:21 -0500
Subject: [OWW-SC] Option to allow OWW users to opt out of mails sent to all
	OWW users has been added.
Message-ID: <26428aaa0801190923x373a5f0cx65406663b05ced34@mail.gmail.com>

Per this month's OWW Steering Committee meeting, the System Preferences page
now has an option on the Misc tab to allow users to opt-out of email
messages sent to all OWW users.

The message is currently on the 'misc' page. The default is for this option
to be disabled, thus setting all OWW users to be in a broadcast message
unless they opt to click the message.

This is the text currently used:       "*Do not send me emails sent to all
site users*"

Any changes, please let me know.


Thanks.

Bill Flanagan
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From julius at younglucks.com  Sat Jan 19 12:53:56 2008
From: julius at younglucks.com (Julius B. Lucks)
Date: Sat, 19 Jan 2008 09:53:56 -0800
Subject: [OWW-SC] Changes to Feedback based upon "preliminary feedback"
In-Reply-To: <26428aaa0801190742m18168a10o545d97194412f5be@mail.gmail.com>
References: <26428aaa0801190742m18168a10o545d97194412f5be@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <9100B848-AF41-4FE1-9762-E43DF03D88FC@younglucks.com>

Great!

Can we automatically remove the email addresses from tge text of the  
archived messages? Just to be safe.

Julius

Please Reply to julius at younglucks.com

On Jan 19, 2008, at 7:42 AM, "Bill F" <bill.altmail at gmail.com> wrote:

> I've made a few changes to the way feedback messages are handled to  
> tighten up the accepting and distribution of those messages.
>
> 1. The System:Contact special page is pretty cool. Feedback is  
> collected from the "feedback form" and delivered to an unpublished  
> email address. We can accept any feedback via the website and handle  
> it as we need to.
>
> 2. I have created a new email alias on OpenWetWare.org to serve as  
> the destination for the feedback messages. This address is a random  
> sequence and will not generally be published.
>
> 3. I removed the "feedback" alias from OpenWetWare.org. All messages  
> to be routed to the Oww-Feedback.mit.edu mailing list will go to the  
> new mail address.
>
> 4. If people find and abuse the " oww-feedback at mit.edu" address  
> badly, we'll fall back the same way by renaming the list or  
> replacing it with an app within OWW or via another web application.
>
> 5. In any discussion of feedback within OWW, please refrain from  
> writing actual email addresses. This will keep the robots from  
> finding and spamming the list.
>
> 6. Anyone on the current OWW-Feedback list will notice no difference  
> in its behavior. The random email address I mentioned is part of the  
> "feedback application" and wasn't intended as an alternate way of  
> submitting feedback.
>
> 7. I am adding a new MediaWiki: system message,  
> "MediaWiki:FeedbackHeaderContent". The contents of this message will  
> be displayed on the form. I'll let people know when it's available.
>
> Let's see how this works. We can use it for other processes which  
> involve taking input from non-OWW members in a controlled manner as  
> they emerge.
>
> Thanks.
>
> Bill
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> OpenWetWare Steering Committee Mailing List
> sc at openwetware.org
> http://mailman.mit.edu/mailman/listinfo/oww-sc
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From julius at younglucks.com  Sat Jan 19 12:55:59 2008
From: julius at younglucks.com (Julius B. Lucks)
Date: Sat, 19 Jan 2008 09:55:59 -0800
Subject: [OWW-SC] Fwd: [Oww-Feedback] Feedback Message (from Dr Alejo
	Corrales)
In-Reply-To: <6e9f40380801190912l5aada446w7605813f6bfe9a33@mail.gmail.com>
References: <20080118214404.9D85E3D2033@mail.openwetware.org>
	<26428aaa0801181546m435e2d8cp48c7735a0ec533ef@mail.gmail.com>
	<8d6c9c85467de72a977e17f2d5de9f56@csail.mit.edu>
	<87hcha8x56.fsf@nitsua.mit.edu>
	<20080119025647.dja7d98gsn40ssos@webmail.younglucks.com>
	<7c085c480801181911h63112c3aq8257c55d9a2c7f1@mail.gmail.com>
	<6e9f40380801190912l5aada446w7605813f6bfe9a33@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <9FC47B87-F34E-447A-9234-A36182E5219F@younglucks.com>

This is a very reasonable policy to try out at first.

Julius

Please Reply to julius at younglucks.com

On Jan 19, 2008, at 9:12 AM, "Reshma Shetty" <rshetty at mit.edu> wrote:

> Hi all,
>
> In response to Tom's suggestion, I've updated the OWW disclaime
> http://openwetware.org/wiki/OpenWetWare:General_disclaimer
> Please feel free to amend.
>
> I think the mechanism for easier feedback to OWW is great.  (Props  
> to Julius for suggesting it and Bill for deploying it so quickly).   
> But I do agree with Jason that OWW should not provide a general  
> mechanism for people without OWW accounts to contact OWW members.  I  
> think OWW users, specifically occasional users, could become quickly  
> turned off by a site that enabled them to get spammed.  Especially  
> since people are probably likely to use their "real" email address  
> to register with OWW rather than their "spam" webmail address.
>
> I'm also pretty wary of allowing anonymous posts to user talk  
> pages.  I think it just invites wiki spam and most OWW users  
> including myself don't want to have to deal with clearing spam even  
> from just their user talk page.  (Based on wikiomics' experience, it  
> can be pretty easy for the spam engines to bury pages in links to  
> britney spears pics.)
>
> Personally, I'd prefer to continue with the feedback system as an  
> email form which anyone can use.  We can relay messages to the  
> intended recipient as needed.  If this option becomes untenable  
> (i.e. a flood of messages not re OWW but re individual pages), then  
> we can reassess.
>
> Just my two cents.
>
> Thanks,
>
> Reshma
>
> On Jan 18, 2008 10:11 PM, Jason Kelly <jasonk at mit.edu> wrote:
> I think we might want to tread carefully on this one.  i assume this
> researcher's (Dr. Berglund) contact info is available through his
> school somehow...could suggest the person who emailed check there.
>
> i wouldn't recommend to the person who emailed that he get an OWW
> account and then start posting on talk pages or anything.  we need to
> be a little protective of community, i think.  This guy isn't a
> biologist or biological engineer doing research -- he's looking for
> medical advice.  And there are much better places for him to find
> that.
>
> Austin, I'm against the email form for users.  If someone wants to get
> random emails, they'll post their contact info.  We already allow
> within-OWW form emailing, which I think covers most bases.  Having a
> pre-requisite of signing up to OWW being that everyone on the internet
> gets to know your email address (even if it's through a form) is too
> much to ask, IMO.
>
> thanks,
> jason
>
> On Jan 18, 2008 9:56 PM,  <julius at younglucks.com> wrote:
> > What about the content of emails being sent to the user talk page
> > instead of emailing them?  Either way, we may run into a spam issue.
> > We also might allow anyone to edit a user talk page for messaging as
> > an alternative.
> >
> > In any case, I will email the 1st feedback user with instructions on
> > how to contact an individual user.
> >
> > Cheers,
> >
> > Julius
> >
> >
> > Quoting Austin Che < austin at csail.mit.edu>:
> >
> > >
> > >     I think we need a way for anyone to email someone on the  
> wiki. For
> > >     example, make this work for non-logged in users.
> > >     http://openwetware.org/wiki/Special:Emailuser/Austin_J._Che
> > >
> > >     Or allow the creation of the feedback forms that send to  
> arbitrary
> > >     email addresses from the wiki.
> > >
> > >     Looking around the Berglund lab page, I couldn't find any  
> other
> > >     way of contacting them.
> > >
> > >> Apparently we need a statement similar to this one in the  
> Pubmed FAQ:
> > >> http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query/static/faq.html
> > >>
> > >> On Jan 18, 2008, at 6:46 PM, Bill F wrote:
> > >>
> > >> We have our first feedback message. I can't figure out what to  
> do with
> > >> it so you folks can decide.
> > >
> > > --
> > > Austin Che           < austin at csail.mit.edu>          (617) 
> 253-5899
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > OpenWetWare Steering Committee Mailing List
> > > sc at openwetware.org
> > > http://mailman.mit.edu/mailman/listinfo/oww-sc
> > >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > OpenWetWare Steering Committee Mailing List
> > sc at openwetware.org
> > http://mailman.mit.edu/mailman/listinfo/oww-sc
> >
> _______________________________________________
> OpenWetWare Steering Committee Mailing List
> sc at openwetware.org
> http://mailman.mit.edu/mailman/listinfo/oww-sc
>
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From bill.altmail at gmail.com  Sun Jan 20 09:14:10 2008
From: bill.altmail at gmail.com (Bill F)
Date: Sun, 20 Jan 2008 09:14:10 -0500
Subject: [OWW-SC] Changes to Feedback based upon "preliminary feedback"
In-Reply-To: <9100B848-AF41-4FE1-9762-E43DF03D88FC@younglucks.com>
References: <26428aaa0801190742m18168a10o545d97194412f5be@mail.gmail.com>
	<9100B848-AF41-4FE1-9762-E43DF03D88FC@younglucks.com>
Message-ID: <26428aaa0801200614i5401f1dembb2d63d2bc1a8f0a@mail.gmail.com>

The text that appears at the top of the Feedback Page now can optionally be
set in MediaWiki:FeedbackHeaderContent. The page can be found here:

http://openwetware.org/wiki/MediaWiki:FeedbackHeaderContent

Since this is a MediaWiki page, it should only be editable via sysadmin
users.

Thanks.

B.


On Jan 19, 2008 12:53 PM, Julius B. Lucks <julius at younglucks.com> wrote:

> Great!
>
> Can we automatically remove the email addresses from tge text of the
> archived messages? Just to be safe.
>
> Julius
>
> Please Reply to <julius at younglucks.com>julius at younglucks.com
>
> On Jan 19, 2008, at 7:42 AM, "Bill F" <bill.altmail at gmail.com> wrote:
>
> I've made a few changes to the way feedback messages are handled to
> tighten up the accepting and distribution of those messages.
>
> 1. The System:Contact special page is pretty cool. Feedback is collected
> from the "feedback form" and delivered to an unpublished email address. We
> can accept any feedback via the website and handle it as we need to.
>
> 2. I have created a new email alias on OpenWetWare.org to serve as the
> destination for the feedback messages. This address is a random sequence and
> will not generally be published.
>
> 3. I removed the "feedback" alias from OpenWetWare.org. All messages to be
> routed to the Oww-Feedback.mit.edu mailing list will go to the new mail
> address.
>
> 4. If people find and abuse the " <oww-feedback at mit.edu>
> oww-feedback at mit.edu" address badly, we'll fall back the same way by
> renaming the list or replacing it with an app within OWW or via another web
> application.
>
> 5. In any discussion of feedback within OWW, please refrain from writing
> actual email addresses. This will keep the robots from finding and spamming
> the list.
>
> 6. Anyone on the current OWW-Feedback list will notice no difference in
> its behavior. The random email address I mentioned is part of the "feedback
> application" and wasn't intended as an alternate way of submitting
> feedback.
>
> 7. I am adding a new MediaWiki: system message,
> "MediaWiki:FeedbackHeaderContent". The contents of this message will be
> displayed on the form. I'll let people know when it's available.
>
> Let's see how this works. We can use it for other processes which involve
> taking input from non-OWW members in a controlled manner as they emerge.
>
> Thanks.
>
> Bill
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> OpenWetWare Steering Committee Mailing List
> sc at openwetware.org
> http://mailman.mit.edu/mailman/listinfo/oww-sc
>
>
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From bill.altmail at gmail.com  Sun Jan 20 09:25:36 2008
From: bill.altmail at gmail.com (Bill F)
Date: Sun, 20 Jan 2008 09:25:36 -0500
Subject: [OWW-SC] Changes to Feedback based upon "preliminary feedback"
In-Reply-To: <9100B848-AF41-4FE1-9762-E43DF03D88FC@younglucks.com>
References: <26428aaa0801190742m18168a10o545d97194412f5be@mail.gmail.com>
	<9100B848-AF41-4FE1-9762-E43DF03D88FC@younglucks.com>
Message-ID: <26428aaa0801200625q2fc58402k6f86cfd9ff6a837@mail.gmail.com>

Julius,

We're using the MIT Mailman mailing list manager. I checked and there's no
way to do this for email addresses in the text of messages. We can hide all
addresses appearing in the headers of messages. I haven't tried it to see
the effect but I don't know whether this simply hides the text or makes
messages not eligible for replies. I'll look at it during the week.

Thanks.

B.


On Jan 19, 2008 12:53 PM, Julius B. Lucks <julius at younglucks.com> wrote:

> Great!
>
> Can we automatically remove the email addresses from tge text of the
> archived messages? Just to be safe.
>
> Julius
>
> Please Reply to <julius at younglucks.com>julius at younglucks.com
>
> On Jan 19, 2008, at 7:42 AM, "Bill F" <bill.altmail at gmail.com> wrote:
>
> I've made a few changes to the way feedback messages are handled to
> tighten up the accepting and distribution of those messages.
>
> 1. The System:Contact special page is pretty cool. Feedback is collected
> from the "feedback form" and delivered to an unpublished email address. We
> can accept any feedback via the website and handle it as we need to.
>
> 2. I have created a new email alias on OpenWetWare.org to serve as the
> destination for the feedback messages. This address is a random sequence and
> will not generally be published.
>
> 3. I removed the "feedback" alias from OpenWetWare.org. All messages to be
> routed to the Oww-Feedback.mit.edu mailing list will go to the new mail
> address.
>
> 4. If people find and abuse the " <oww-feedback at mit.edu>
> oww-feedback at mit.edu" address badly, we'll fall back the same way by
> renaming the list or replacing it with an app within OWW or via another web
> application.
>
> 5. In any discussion of feedback within OWW, please refrain from writing
> actual email addresses. This will keep the robots from finding and spamming
> the list.
>
> 6. Anyone on the current OWW-Feedback list will notice no difference in
> its behavior. The random email address I mentioned is part of the "feedback
> application" and wasn't intended as an alternate way of submitting
> feedback.
>
> 7. I am adding a new MediaWiki: system message,
> "MediaWiki:FeedbackHeaderContent". The contents of this message will be
> displayed on the form. I'll let people know when it's available.
>
> Let's see how this works. We can use it for other processes which involve
> taking input from non-OWW members in a controlled manner as they emerge.
>
> Thanks.
>
> Bill
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> OpenWetWare Steering Committee Mailing List
> sc at openwetware.org
> http://mailman.mit.edu/mailman/listinfo/oww-sc
>
>
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From rshetty at MIT.EDU  Sun Jan 20 12:25:24 2008
From: rshetty at MIT.EDU (Reshma Shetty)
Date: Sun, 20 Jan 2008 12:25:24 -0500
Subject: [OWW-SC] New icons for OWW Feedback and Lab Notebook
In-Reply-To: <26428aaa0801171316q126b4e4cs514b7cb0a7130970@mail.gmail.com>
References: <26428aaa0801171316q126b4e4cs514b7cb0a7130970@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <6e9f40380801200925h27c88a5evd3ee304c36786d0a@mail.gmail.com>

Hey all,

Some quick suggestions re navigation on the site ...

1) Let's use the current community portal navigation bar icon (the talk
bubble) as the icon for feedback and remove the community portal link from
the navigation bar.  Although I think the community portal should be useful,
I am not sure that we've effectively figured out how to use the community
portal page on OWW so keeping it in the navigation box on the side is
probably unnecessary.  In the two days since the feedback page was launched,
I think it has shown itself to be more useful than the community portal ever
was :)  Does anyone on the SC use the community portal or object to this
change?

2) I've switched out the community portal button on the main page to instead
point to blogs.  Again, I think blogs are gaining more traction than the
community portal ever did.  Please let me know if you object.  (We talked
about this idea previously at an SC meeting but we never actually
implemented it.)

3) I've removed the random page link from the default mediawiki sidebar.
Again, I don't think it is a particularly useful link to justify being
included on all pages by default.  But let me know if you object.

-Reshma

PS I'm also ok with a new loudspeaker-like icon for the feedback link.  I
just don't like the current icon that's there ... though I think Bill did
exactly the right think in just posting the feedback link with an icon
rather than waiting to get the perfect icon.

On Jan 17, 2008 4:16 PM, Bill F <bill.altmail at gmail.com> wrote:

> Jenny,
>
> We need to come up with a few icons for OpenWetWare. I'd like some
> advice/assistance from you when you have a chance. If anyone else has any
> ideas, please let us know.
>
> We need two of the tiny blue icons the same size as the house, lab beaker,
> question mark, etc. that used are in the
> navigation links on the left hand side of all wiki pages.
>
> "Donate" will be under the "Random page" item.
> "Feedback" will be the last item, just under donate. If we had a larger
> version of the same icon available, I can include it on the page.
>
> Any suggestions on what to use for these items?
>
> We also would like to come up with a set of icons/graphics for the Lab
> Notebook. We have three levels in the lab notebook:
>
> Main Lab Notebook
> Project
> Entry
>
> We can use consistent icons on all pages or use variations for the main
> level, the project view, and the entry (date) view.
>
> Let me know what you all think about how this might work.
>
>
> Thanks.
>
>
> Bill Flanagan
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> OpenWetWare Steering Committee Mailing List
> sc at openwetware.org
> http://mailman.mit.edu/mailman/listinfo/oww-sc
>
>
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From julius at younglucks.com  Sun Jan 20 12:36:47 2008
From: julius at younglucks.com (Julius B. Lucks)
Date: Sun, 20 Jan 2008 09:36:47 -0800
Subject: [OWW-SC] Changes to Feedback based upon "preliminary feedback"
In-Reply-To: <26428aaa0801200625q2fc58402k6f86cfd9ff6a837@mail.gmail.com>
References: <26428aaa0801190742m18168a10o545d97194412f5be@mail.gmail.com>
	<9100B848-AF41-4FE1-9762-E43DF03D88FC@younglucks.com>
	<26428aaa0801200625q2fc58402k6f86cfd9ff6a837@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <6E361D5D-43BC-4FB7-8915-B7C0AD3057CB@younglucks.com>

Hey Bill,

Things seem to be working very well right now.  I would suggest that  
we eventually put these emails in some sort of queueing system so  
that we can manage which emails have been answered, and which users  
to send an email back to when a feature has changed that they were  
interested in - could eventum handle this?

For now I would suggest that everyone reply to the whole feedback  
list so that we know what has been responded to.  I forgot to do this  
for the 1st one, but I will do for the second one.  I'll also write  
an SC blog post today.

Cheers,

Julius

------------------------------------------------------------------------ 
---------------
Please Reply to My Permanent Address: julius at younglucks.com
http://www.openwetware.org/wiki/User:Julius_B._Lucks
------------------------------------------------------------------------ 
----------------



On Jan 20, 2008, at 6:25 AM, Bill F wrote:

> Julius,
>
> We're using the MIT Mailman mailing list manager. I checked and  
> there's no way to do this for email addresses in the text of  
> messages. We can hide all addresses appearing in the headers of  
> messages. I haven't tried it to see the effect but I don't know  
> whether this simply hides the text or makes messages not eligible  
> for replies. I'll look at it during the week.
>
> Thanks.
>
> B.
>
>
> On Jan 19, 2008 12:53 PM, Julius B. Lucks <julius at younglucks.com>  
> wrote:
> Great!
>
> Can we automatically remove the email addresses from tge text of  
> the archived messages? Just to be safe.
>
> Julius
>
> Please Reply to julius at younglucks.com
>
> On Jan 19, 2008, at 7:42 AM, "Bill F" < bill.altmail at gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> I've made a few changes to the way feedback messages are handled  
>> to tighten up the accepting and distribution of those messages.
>>
>> 1. The System:Contact special page is pretty cool. Feedback is  
>> collected from the "feedback form" and delivered to an unpublished  
>> email address. We can accept any feedback via the website and  
>> handle it as we need to.
>>
>> 2. I have created a new email alias on OpenWetWare.org to serve as  
>> the destination for the feedback messages. This address is a  
>> random sequence and will not generally be published.
>>
>> 3. I removed the "feedback" alias from OpenWetWare.org. All  
>> messages to be routed to the Oww-Feedback.mit.edu mailing list  
>> will go to the new mail address.
>>
>> 4. If people find and abuse the " oww-feedback at mit.edu" address  
>> badly, we'll fall back the same way by renaming the list or  
>> replacing it with an app within OWW or via another web application.
>>
>> 5. In any discussion of feedback within OWW, please refrain from  
>> writing actual email addresses. This will keep the robots from  
>> finding and spamming the list.
>>
>> 6. Anyone on the current OWW-Feedback list will notice no  
>> difference in its behavior. The random email address I mentioned  
>> is part of the "feedback application" and wasn't intended as an  
>> alternate way of submitting feedback.
>>
>> 7. I am adding a new MediaWiki: system message,  
>> "MediaWiki:FeedbackHeaderContent". The contents of this message  
>> will be displayed on the form. I'll let people know when it's  
>> available.
>>
>> Let's see how this works. We can use it for other processes which  
>> involve taking input from non-OWW members in a controlled manner  
>> as they emerge.
>>
>> Thanks.
>>
>> Bill
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> OpenWetWare Steering Committee Mailing List
>> sc at openwetware.org
>> http://mailman.mit.edu/mailman/listinfo/oww-sc
>

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From bill.altmail at gmail.com  Sun Jan 20 12:53:41 2008
From: bill.altmail at gmail.com (Bill F)
Date: Sun, 20 Jan 2008 12:53:41 -0500
Subject: [OWW-SC] Changes to Feedback based upon "preliminary feedback"
In-Reply-To: <6E361D5D-43BC-4FB7-8915-B7C0AD3057CB@younglucks.com>
References: <26428aaa0801190742m18168a10o545d97194412f5be@mail.gmail.com>
	<9100B848-AF41-4FE1-9762-E43DF03D88FC@younglucks.com>
	<26428aaa0801200625q2fc58402k6f86cfd9ff6a837@mail.gmail.com>
	<6E361D5D-43BC-4FB7-8915-B7C0AD3057CB@younglucks.com>
Message-ID: <26428aaa0801200953k6752fa1csde5670f6d083c5ee@mail.gmail.com>

good suggestion. For now, the list server is saving them. we can refer to
them indirectly if need be.

B.


On Jan 20, 2008 12:36 PM, Julius B. Lucks <julius at younglucks.com> wrote:

> Hey Bill,
> Things seem to be working very well right now.  I would suggest that we
> eventually put these emails in some sort of queueing system so that we can
> manage which emails have been answered, and which users to send an email
> back to when a feature has changed that they were interested in - could
> eventum handle this?
>
> For now I would suggest that everyone reply to the whole feedback list so
> that we know what has been responded to.  I forgot to do this for the 1st
> one, but I will do for the second one.  I'll also write an SC blog post
> today.
>
> Cheers,
>
> Julius
>
>
> ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Please Reply to My Permanent Address: julius at younglucks.com
> http://www.openwetware.org/wiki/User:Julius_B._Lucks
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
>
>
> On Jan 20, 2008, at 6:25 AM, Bill F wrote:
>
> Julius,
>
> We're using the MIT Mailman mailing list manager. I checked and there's no
> way to do this for email addresses in the text of messages. We can hide all
> addresses appearing in the headers of messages. I haven't tried it to see
> the effect but I don't know whether this simply hides the text or makes
> messages not eligible for replies. I'll look at it during the week.
>
> Thanks.
>
> B.
>
>
> On Jan 19, 2008 12:53 PM, Julius B. Lucks <julius at younglucks.com> wrote:
>
> > Great!
> >
> > Can we automatically remove the email addresses from tge text of the
> > archived messages? Just to be safe.
> >
> > Julius
> >
> > Please Reply to  <julius at younglucks.com>julius at younglucks.com
> >
> > On Jan 19, 2008, at 7:42 AM, "Bill F" < bill.altmail at gmail.com> wrote:
> >
> > I've made a few changes to the way feedback messages are handled to
> > tighten up the accepting and distribution of those messages.
> >
> > 1. The System:Contact special page is pretty cool. Feedback is collected
> > from the "feedback form" and delivered to an unpublished email address. We
> > can accept any feedback via the website and handle it as we need to.
> >
> > 2. I have created a new email alias on OpenWetWare.org to serve as the
> > destination for the feedback messages. This address is a random sequence and
> > will not generally be published.
> >
> > 3. I removed the "feedback" alias from OpenWetWare.org. All messages to
> > be routed to the Oww-Feedback.mit.edu mailing list will go to the new
> > mail address.
> >
> > 4. If people find and abuse the "  <oww-feedback at mit.edu>
> > oww-feedback at mit.edu" address badly, we'll fall back the same way by
> > renaming the list or replacing it with an app within OWW or via another web
> > application.
> >
> > 5. In any discussion of feedback within OWW, please refrain from writing
> > actual email addresses. This will keep the robots from finding and spamming
> > the list.
> >
> > 6. Anyone on the current OWW-Feedback list will notice no difference in
> > its behavior. The random email address I mentioned is part of the "feedback
> > application" and wasn't intended as an alternate way of submitting
> > feedback.
> >
> > 7. I am adding a new MediaWiki: system message,
> > "MediaWiki:FeedbackHeaderContent". The contents of this message will be
> > displayed on the form. I'll let people know when it's available.
> >
> > Let's see how this works. We can use it for other processes which
> > involve taking input from non-OWW members in a controlled manner as they
> > emerge.
> >
> > Thanks.
> >
> > Bill
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > OpenWetWare Steering Committee Mailing List
> > sc at openwetware.org
> > http://mailman.mit.edu/mailman/listinfo/oww-sc
> >
> >
>
>
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From jennytnguyen at gmail.com  Sun Jan 20 16:54:32 2008
From: jennytnguyen at gmail.com (Jenny Nguyen)
Date: Sun, 20 Jan 2008 15:54:32 -0600
Subject: [OWW-SC] New icons for OWW Feedback and Lab Notebook
In-Reply-To: <6e9f40380801200925h27c88a5evd3ee304c36786d0a@mail.gmail.com>
References: <26428aaa0801171316q126b4e4cs514b7cb0a7130970@mail.gmail.com>
	<6e9f40380801200925h27c88a5evd3ee304c36786d0a@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <cf36c28d0801201354w347cc1b0wb20fcdb24fc4fda2@mail.gmail.com>

All sounds good. Just let me know what icons I now need to make along with
feedback on what ideas you have for that icon.

Jenny

On Jan 20, 2008 11:25 AM, Reshma Shetty <rshetty at mit.edu> wrote:

> Hey all,
>
> Some quick suggestions re navigation on the site ...
>
> 1) Let's use the current community portal navigation bar icon (the talk
> bubble) as the icon for feedback and remove the community portal link from
> the navigation bar.  Although I think the community portal should be useful,
> I am not sure that we've effectively figured out how to use the community
> portal page on OWW so keeping it in the navigation box on the side is
> probably unnecessary.  In the two days since the feedback page was launched,
> I think it has shown itself to be more useful than the community portal ever
> was :)  Does anyone on the SC use the community portal or object to this
> change?
>
> 2) I've switched out the community portal button on the main page to
> instead point to blogs.  Again, I think blogs are gaining more traction than
> the community portal ever did.  Please let me know if you object.  (We
> talked about this idea previously at an SC meeting but we never actually
> implemented it.)
>
> 3) I've removed the random page link from the default mediawiki sidebar.
> Again, I don't think it is a particularly useful link to justify being
> included on all pages by default.  But let me know if you object.
>
> -Reshma
>
> PS I'm also ok with a new loudspeaker-like icon for the feedback link.  I
> just don't like the current icon that's there ... though I think Bill did
> exactly the right think in just posting the feedback link with an icon
> rather than waiting to get the perfect icon.
>
> On Jan 17, 2008 4:16 PM, Bill F <bill.altmail at gmail.com> wrote:
>
> > Jenny,
> >
> > We need to come up with a few icons for OpenWetWare. I'd like some
> > advice/assistance from you when you have a chance. If anyone else has any
> > ideas, please let us know.
> >
> > We need two of the tiny blue icons the same size as the house, lab
> > beaker, question mark, etc. that used are in the
> > navigation links on the left hand side of all wiki pages.
> >
> > "Donate" will be under the "Random page" item.
> > "Feedback" will be the last item, just under donate. If we had a larger
> > version of the same icon available, I can include it on the page.
> >
> > Any suggestions on what to use for these items?
> >
> > We also would like to come up with a set of icons/graphics for the Lab
> > Notebook. We have three levels in the lab notebook:
> >
> > Main Lab Notebook
> > Project
> > Entry
> >
> > We can use consistent icons on all pages or use variations for the main
> > level, the project view, and the entry (date) view.
> >
> > Let me know what you all think about how this might work.
> >
> >
> > Thanks.
> >
> >
> > Bill Flanagan
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > OpenWetWare Steering Committee Mailing List
> > sc at openwetware.org
> > http://mailman.mit.edu/mailman/listinfo/oww-sc
> >
> >
>
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From austin at csail.mit.edu  Sun Jan 20 17:12:20 2008
From: austin at csail.mit.edu (Austin Che)
Date: Sun, 20 Jan 2008 17:12:20 -0500
Subject: [OWW-SC] New icons for OWW Feedback and Lab Notebook
In-Reply-To: <6e9f40380801200925h27c88a5evd3ee304c36786d0a@mail.gmail.com>
	(Reshma Shetty's message of "Sun, 20 Jan 2008 12:25:24 -0500")
References: <26428aaa0801171316q126b4e4cs514b7cb0a7130970@mail.gmail.com>
	<6e9f40380801200925h27c88a5evd3ee304c36786d0a@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <87r6gcywmz.fsf@nitsua.mit.edu>


> 2) I've switched out the community portal button on the main page to instead
> point to blogs.  Again, I think blogs are gaining more traction than the
> community portal ever did.  Please let me know if you object.  (We talked
> about this idea previously at an SC meeting but we never actually
> implemented it.)
>
> 3) I've removed the random page link from the default mediawiki sidebar.
> Again, I don't think it is a particularly useful link to justify being
> included on all pages by default.  But let me know if you object.

    I agree with the things that have been removed from the
    sidebar. But we have plenty of extra space there and if really
    think the buttons on the front page are important, we should just
    put them in the sidebar. It would reduce the front page
    clutter and allow people coming in at a random page to see that
    there's more on the site than whatever they're looking at.

    BTW, oww is "slow" loading with 71% of sites being faster than us
    http://www.alexa.com/data/details/main/openwetware.org
    I'm sure having many different icons doesn't help.

-- 
Austin Che           <austin at csail.mit.edu>          (617)253-5899


From bill.altmail at gmail.com  Mon Jan 21 09:50:59 2008
From: bill.altmail at gmail.com (Bill F)
Date: Mon, 21 Jan 2008 09:50:59 -0500
Subject: [OWW-SC] New icons for OWW Feedback and Lab Notebook
In-Reply-To: <87r6gcywmz.fsf@nitsua.mit.edu>
References: <26428aaa0801171316q126b4e4cs514b7cb0a7130970@mail.gmail.com>
	<6e9f40380801200925h27c88a5evd3ee304c36786d0a@mail.gmail.com>
	<87r6gcywmz.fsf@nitsua.mit.edu>
Message-ID: <26428aaa0801210650k458faaf3i506b8aa0320a8de4@mail.gmail.com>

The front page now has 2 buttons for blogs; one in the top bar and another
below in the "News Highlights". They both say, "start a blog" below them.
One points to a Wiki page while the other points to a raw  HTML page.

Do we need 2 different buttons for blogs?  If so, should they point to the
same place?


 On Jan 20, 2008 5:12 PM, Austin Che <austin at csail.mit.edu> wrote:

>
> > 2) I've switched out the community portal button on the main page to
> instead
> > point to blogs.  Again, I think blogs are gaining more traction than the
> > community portal ever did.  Please let me know if you object.  (We
> talked
> > about this idea previously at an SC meeting but we never actually
> > implemented it.)
> >
> > 3) I've removed the random page link from the default mediawiki sidebar.
> > Again, I don't think it is a particularly useful link to justify being
> > included on all pages by default.  But let me know if you object.
>
>    I agree with the things that have been removed from the
>    sidebar. But we have plenty of extra space there and if really
>    think the buttons on the front page are important, we should just
>    put them in the sidebar. It would reduce the front page
>    clutter and allow people coming in at a random page to see that
>    there's more on the site than whatever they're looking at.
>
>    BTW, oww is "slow" loading with 71% of sites being faster than us
>    http://www.alexa.com/data/details/main/openwetware.org
>    I'm sure having many different icons doesn't help.
>
> --
> Austin Che           <austin at csail.mit.edu>          (617)253-5899
> _______________________________________________
> OpenWetWare Steering Committee Mailing List
> sc at openwetware.org
> http://mailman.mit.edu/mailman/listinfo/oww-sc
>
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From jasonk at MIT.EDU  Mon Jan 21 10:21:49 2008
From: jasonk at MIT.EDU (Jason Kelly)
Date: Mon, 21 Jan 2008 10:21:49 -0500
Subject: [OWW-SC] New icons for OWW Feedback and Lab Notebook
In-Reply-To: <26428aaa0801210650k458faaf3i506b8aa0320a8de4@mail.gmail.com>
References: <26428aaa0801171316q126b4e4cs514b7cb0a7130970@mail.gmail.com>
	<6e9f40380801200925h27c88a5evd3ee304c36786d0a@mail.gmail.com>
	<87r6gcywmz.fsf@nitsua.mit.edu>
	<26428aaa0801210650k458faaf3i506b8aa0320a8de4@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <7c085c480801210721h1231fb89vf8af2b8555a250a0@mail.gmail.com>

we might just drop the "news highlights" altogether and just use the
SC blog for that as well.  Seems like funneling more content through
the blog increases the odds that it stays fresh.  Will also help to
de-clutter the front page.

thanks,
jason

On Jan 21, 2008 9:50 AM, Bill F <bill.altmail at gmail.com> wrote:
> The front page now has 2 buttons for blogs; one in the top bar and another
> below in the "News Highlights". They both say, "start a blog" below them.
> One points to a Wiki page while the other points to a raw  HTML page.
>
> Do we need 2 different buttons for blogs?  If so, should they point to the
> same place?
>
>
>
>
>  On Jan 20, 2008 5:12 PM, Austin Che <austin at csail.mit.edu > wrote:
> >
> >
> > > 2) I've switched out the community portal button on the main page to
> instead
> > > point to blogs.  Again, I think blogs are gaining more traction than the
> > > community portal ever did.  Please let me know if you object.  (We
> talked
> > > about this idea previously at an SC meeting but we never actually
> > > implemented it.)
> > >
> > > 3) I've removed the random page link from the default mediawiki sidebar.
> > > Again, I don't think it is a particularly useful link to justify being
> > > included on all pages by default.  But let me know if you object.
> >
> >    I agree with the things that have been removed from the
> >    sidebar. But we have plenty of extra space there and if really
> >    think the buttons on the front page are important, we should just
> >    put them in the sidebar. It would reduce the front page
> >    clutter and allow people coming in at a random page to see that
> >    there's more on the site than whatever they're looking at.
> >
> >    BTW, oww is "slow" loading with 71% of sites being faster than us
> >    http://www.alexa.com/data/details/main/openwetware.org
> >    I'm sure having many different icons doesn't help.
> >
> > --
> > Austin Che           <austin at csail.mit.edu>          (617)253-5899
> >
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > OpenWetWare Steering Committee Mailing List
> > sc at openwetware.org
> > http://mailman.mit.edu/mailman/listinfo/oww-sc
> >
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> OpenWetWare Steering Committee Mailing List
> sc at openwetware.org
> http://mailman.mit.edu/mailman/listinfo/oww-sc
>
>


From bill.altmail at gmail.com  Mon Jan 21 11:11:28 2008
From: bill.altmail at gmail.com (Bill F)
Date: Mon, 21 Jan 2008 11:11:28 -0500
Subject: [OWW-SC] New icons for OWW Feedback and Lab Notebook
In-Reply-To: <7c085c480801210721h1231fb89vf8af2b8555a250a0@mail.gmail.com>
References: <26428aaa0801171316q126b4e4cs514b7cb0a7130970@mail.gmail.com>
	<6e9f40380801200925h27c88a5evd3ee304c36786d0a@mail.gmail.com>
	<87r6gcywmz.fsf@nitsua.mit.edu>
	<26428aaa0801210650k458faaf3i506b8aa0320a8de4@mail.gmail.com>
	<7c085c480801210721h1231fb89vf8af2b8555a250a0@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <26428aaa0801210811t61ec084alb2f0d47f804bd214@mail.gmail.com>

Good idea. That gets rid of the redundant use of 'news' on the front page as
well. It makes the top buttons unambiguous. We should move the contents of
the new highlights into the blog and flip the switch.

So are we going to do it?

If so, who?


On Jan 21, 2008 10:21 AM, Jason Kelly <jasonk at mit.edu> wrote:

> we might just drop the "news highlights" altogether and just use the
> SC blog for that as well.  Seems like funneling more content through
> the blog increases the odds that it stays fresh.  Will also help to
> de-clutter the front page.
>
> thanks,
> jason
>
> On Jan 21, 2008 9:50 AM, Bill F <bill.altmail at gmail.com> wrote:
> > The front page now has 2 buttons for blogs; one in the top bar and
> another
> > below in the "News Highlights". They both say, "start a blog" below
> them.
> > One points to a Wiki page while the other points to a raw  HTML page.
> >
> > Do we need 2 different buttons for blogs?  If so, should they point to
> the
> > same place?
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >  On Jan 20, 2008 5:12 PM, Austin Che <austin at csail.mit.edu > wrote:
> > >
> > >
> > > > 2) I've switched out the community portal button on the main page to
> > instead
> > > > point to blogs.  Again, I think blogs are gaining more traction than
> the
> > > > community portal ever did.  Please let me know if you object.  (We
> > talked
> > > > about this idea previously at an SC meeting but we never actually
> > > > implemented it.)
> > > >
> > > > 3) I've removed the random page link from the default mediawiki
> sidebar.
> > > > Again, I don't think it is a particularly useful link to justify
> being
> > > > included on all pages by default.  But let me know if you object.
> > >
> > >    I agree with the things that have been removed from the
> > >    sidebar. But we have plenty of extra space there and if really
> > >    think the buttons on the front page are important, we should just
> > >    put them in the sidebar. It would reduce the front page
> > >    clutter and allow people coming in at a random page to see that
> > >    there's more on the site than whatever they're looking at.
> > >
> > >    BTW, oww is "slow" loading with 71% of sites being faster than us
> > >    http://www.alexa.com/data/details/main/openwetware.org
> > >    I'm sure having many different icons doesn't help.
> > >
> > > --
> > > Austin Che           <austin at csail.mit.edu>          (617)253-5899
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > OpenWetWare Steering Committee Mailing List
> > > sc at openwetware.org
> > > http://mailman.mit.edu/mailman/listinfo/oww-sc
> > >
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > OpenWetWare Steering Committee Mailing List
> > sc at openwetware.org
> > http://mailman.mit.edu/mailman/listinfo/oww-sc
> >
> >
>
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From rshetty at MIT.EDU  Mon Jan 21 11:14:40 2008
From: rshetty at MIT.EDU (Reshma Shetty)
Date: Mon, 21 Jan 2008 11:14:40 -0500
Subject: [OWW-SC] New icons for OWW Feedback and Lab Notebook
In-Reply-To: <26428aaa0801210811t61ec084alb2f0d47f804bd214@mail.gmail.com>
References: <26428aaa0801171316q126b4e4cs514b7cb0a7130970@mail.gmail.com>
	<6e9f40380801200925h27c88a5evd3ee304c36786d0a@mail.gmail.com>
	<87r6gcywmz.fsf@nitsua.mit.edu>
	<26428aaa0801210650k458faaf3i506b8aa0320a8de4@mail.gmail.com>
	<7c085c480801210721h1231fb89vf8af2b8555a250a0@mail.gmail.com>
	<26428aaa0801210811t61ec084alb2f0d47f804bd214@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <6e9f40380801210814k37f338dap2c6a3450abbf3012@mail.gmail.com>

I was thinking the same thing.  Everything on it is either a button, in the
blog already or has been a news highlight for a while.  Plus, this at least
slightly decreases the size of the main page.

So I just went ahead and removed the news highlights.  New highlights can be
posted to the blog in the future.

-Reshma

On Jan 21, 2008 11:11 AM, Bill F <bill.altmail at gmail.com> wrote:

> Good idea. That gets rid of the redundant use of 'news' on the front page
> as well. It makes the top buttons unambiguous. We should move the contents
> of the new highlights into the blog and flip the switch.
>
> So are we going to do it?
>
> If so, who?
>
>
>
> On Jan 21, 2008 10:21 AM, Jason Kelly <jasonk at mit.edu> wrote:
>
> > we might just drop the "news highlights" altogether and just use the
> > SC blog for that as well.  Seems like funneling more content through
> > the blog increases the odds that it stays fresh.  Will also help to
> > de-clutter the front page.
> >
> > thanks,
> > jason
> >
> > On Jan 21, 2008 9:50 AM, Bill F <bill.altmail at gmail.com > wrote:
> > > The front page now has 2 buttons for blogs; one in the top bar and
> > another
> > > below in the "News Highlights". They both say, "start a blog" below
> > them.
> > > One points to a Wiki page while the other points to a raw  HTML page.
> > >
> > > Do we need 2 different buttons for blogs?  If so, should they point to
> > the
> > > same place?
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >  On Jan 20, 2008 5:12 PM, Austin Che < austin at csail.mit.edu > wrote:
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > > 2) I've switched out the community portal button on the main page
> > to
> > > instead
> > > > > point to blogs.  Again, I think blogs are gaining more traction
> > than the
> > > > > community portal ever did.  Please let me know if you object.  (We
> > > talked
> > > > > about this idea previously at an SC meeting but we never actually
> > > > > implemented it.)
> > > > >
> > > > > 3) I've removed the random page link from the default mediawiki
> > sidebar.
> > > > > Again, I don't think it is a particularly useful link to justify
> > being
> > > > > included on all pages by default.  But let me know if you object.
> > > >
> > > >    I agree with the things that have been removed from the
> > > >    sidebar. But we have plenty of extra space there and if really
> > > >    think the buttons on the front page are important, we should just
> >
> > > >    put them in the sidebar. It would reduce the front page
> > > >    clutter and allow people coming in at a random page to see that
> > > >    there's more on the site than whatever they're looking at.
> > > >
> > > >    BTW, oww is "slow" loading with 71% of sites being faster than us
> > > >    http://www.alexa.com/data/details/main/openwetware.org
> > > >    I'm sure having many different icons doesn't help.
> > > >
> > > > --
> > > > Austin Che           <austin at csail.mit.edu>          (617)253-5899
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > _______________________________________________
> > > > OpenWetWare Steering Committee Mailing List
> > > > sc at openwetware.org
> > > > http://mailman.mit.edu/mailman/listinfo/oww-sc
> > > >
> > >
> > >
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > OpenWetWare Steering Committee Mailing List
> > > sc at openwetware.org
> > > http://mailman.mit.edu/mailman/listinfo/oww-sc
> > >
> > >
> >
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> OpenWetWare Steering Committee Mailing List
> sc at openwetware.org
> http://mailman.mit.edu/mailman/listinfo/oww-sc
>
>
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From austin at csail.mit.edu  Mon Jan 21 11:24:37 2008
From: austin at csail.mit.edu (Austin Che)
Date: Mon, 21 Jan 2008 11:24:37 -0500
Subject: [OWW-SC] New icons for OWW Feedback and Lab Notebook
In-Reply-To: <6e9f40380801210814k37f338dap2c6a3450abbf3012@mail.gmail.com>
	(Reshma Shetty's message of "Mon, 21 Jan 2008 11:14:40 -0500")
References: <26428aaa0801171316q126b4e4cs514b7cb0a7130970@mail.gmail.com>
	<6e9f40380801200925h27c88a5evd3ee304c36786d0a@mail.gmail.com>
	<87r6gcywmz.fsf@nitsua.mit.edu>
	<26428aaa0801210650k458faaf3i506b8aa0320a8de4@mail.gmail.com>
	<7c085c480801210721h1231fb89vf8af2b8555a250a0@mail.gmail.com>
	<26428aaa0801210811t61ec084alb2f0d47f804bd214@mail.gmail.com>
	<6e9f40380801210814k37f338dap2c6a3450abbf3012@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <87tzl7xi2i.fsf@nitsua.mit.edu>


    While we're on redundancy, the About Us link is present three
    times, and the Help and Protocols links are present twice on the
    main page. It seems the Resources button should go into the
    sidebar with the other resources. It's unclear why Protocols is a
    button but Materials isn't. I think it would be easy to make that
    bar into a single line of buttons and remove the duplicates and
    move some into the sidebar. Perhaps a bar with just Labs, Courses,
    Groups, and Blogs.
    
> I was thinking the same thing.  Everything on it is either a button, in the
> blog already or has been a news highlight for a while.  Plus, this at least
> slightly decreases the size of the main page.
>
> So I just went ahead and removed the news highlights.  New highlights can be
> posted to the blog in the future.
>
> -Reshma
>
> On Jan 21, 2008 11:11 AM, Bill F <bill.altmail at gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> Good idea. That gets rid of the redundant use of 'news' on the front page
>> as well. It makes the top buttons unambiguous. We should move the contents
>> of the new highlights into the blog and flip the switch.
>>
>> So are we going to do it?

-- 
Austin Che           <austin at csail.mit.edu>          (617)253-5899


From julius at younglucks.com  Mon Jan 21 11:34:41 2008
From: julius at younglucks.com (Julius B. Lucks)
Date: Mon, 21 Jan 2008 08:34:41 -0800
Subject: [OWW-SC] New icons for OWW Feedback and Lab Notebook
In-Reply-To: <87tzl7xi2i.fsf@nitsua.mit.edu>
References: <26428aaa0801171316q126b4e4cs514b7cb0a7130970@mail.gmail.com>
	<6e9f40380801200925h27c88a5evd3ee304c36786d0a@mail.gmail.com>
	<87r6gcywmz.fsf@nitsua.mit.edu>
	<26428aaa0801210650k458faaf3i506b8aa0320a8de4@mail.gmail.com>
	<7c085c480801210721h1231fb89vf8af2b8555a250a0@mail.gmail.com>
	<26428aaa0801210811t61ec084alb2f0d47f804bd214@mail.gmail.com>
	<6e9f40380801210814k37f338dap2c6a3450abbf3012@mail.gmail.com>
	<87tzl7xi2i.fsf@nitsua.mit.edu>
Message-ID: <CB74BE9A-F711-46E4-B3FC-E6A6D6329F06@younglucks.com>

These all sound like good ideas.

Of course when it is finished, someone should do an sc blog post  
about the changes!

Julius

------------------------------------------------------------------------ 
---------------
Please Reply to My Permanent Address: julius at younglucks.com
http://www.openwetware.org/wiki/User:Julius_B._Lucks
------------------------------------------------------------------------ 
----------------



On Jan 21, 2008, at 8:24 AM, Austin Che wrote:

>
>     While we're on redundancy, the About Us link is present three
>     times, and the Help and Protocols links are present twice on the
>     main page. It seems the Resources button should go into the
>     sidebar with the other resources. It's unclear why Protocols is a
>     button but Materials isn't. I think it would be easy to make that
>     bar into a single line of buttons and remove the duplicates and
>     move some into the sidebar. Perhaps a bar with just Labs, Courses,
>     Groups, and Blogs.
>
>> I was thinking the same thing.  Everything on it is either a  
>> button, in the
>> blog already or has been a news highlight for a while.  Plus, this  
>> at least
>> slightly decreases the size of the main page.
>>
>> So I just went ahead and removed the news highlights.  New  
>> highlights can be
>> posted to the blog in the future.
>>
>> -Reshma
>>
>> On Jan 21, 2008 11:11 AM, Bill F <bill.altmail at gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> Good idea. That gets rid of the redundant use of 'news' on the  
>>> front page
>>> as well. It makes the top buttons unambiguous. We should move the  
>>> contents
>>> of the new highlights into the blog and flip the switch.
>>>
>>> So are we going to do it?
>
> -- 
> Austin Che           <austin at csail.mit.edu>          (617)253-5899
> _______________________________________________
> OpenWetWare Steering Committee Mailing List
> sc at openwetware.org
> http://mailman.mit.edu/mailman/listinfo/oww-sc

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From rshetty at MIT.EDU  Tue Jan 22 10:01:06 2008
From: rshetty at MIT.EDU (Reshma Shetty)
Date: Tue, 22 Jan 2008 10:01:06 -0500
Subject: [OWW-SC] New icons for OWW Feedback and Lab Notebook
In-Reply-To: <87tzl7xi2i.fsf@nitsua.mit.edu>
References: <26428aaa0801171316q126b4e4cs514b7cb0a7130970@mail.gmail.com>
	<6e9f40380801200925h27c88a5evd3ee304c36786d0a@mail.gmail.com>
	<87r6gcywmz.fsf@nitsua.mit.edu>
	<26428aaa0801210650k458faaf3i506b8aa0320a8de4@mail.gmail.com>
	<7c085c480801210721h1231fb89vf8af2b8555a250a0@mail.gmail.com>
	<26428aaa0801210811t61ec084alb2f0d47f804bd214@mail.gmail.com>
	<6e9f40380801210814k37f338dap2c6a3450abbf3012@mail.gmail.com>
	<87tzl7xi2i.fsf@nitsua.mit.edu>
Message-ID: <6e9f40380801220701w27de9f16kfa7a0bbae47bddb8@mail.gmail.com>

I went ahead and implemented these changes.  I'm not 100% sure it is a good
idea because Protocols are pretty heavily used on the site so having a
prominent button can be useful.  This button bar isn't just on the main page
but also shows up on several other pages.  But we'll give it a shot.

Let me know what folks think.  We can always roll back the change.

-Reshma

On Jan 21, 2008 11:24 AM, Austin Che <austin at csail.mit.edu> wrote:

>
>    While we're on redundancy, the About Us link is present three
>    times, and the Help and Protocols links are present twice on the
>    main page. It seems the Resources button should go into the
>    sidebar with the other resources. It's unclear why Protocols is a
>    button but Materials isn't. I think it would be easy to make that
>    bar into a single line of buttons and remove the duplicates and
>    move some into the sidebar. Perhaps a bar with just Labs, Courses,
>    Groups, and Blogs.
>
> > I was thinking the same thing.  Everything on it is either a button, in
> the
> > blog already or has been a news highlight for a while.  Plus, this at
> least
> > slightly decreases the size of the main page.
> >
> > So I just went ahead and removed the news highlights.  New highlights
> can be
> > posted to the blog in the future.
> >
> > -Reshma
> >
> > On Jan 21, 2008 11:11 AM, Bill F <bill.altmail at gmail.com> wrote:
> >
> >> Good idea. That gets rid of the redundant use of 'news' on the front
> page
> >> as well. It makes the top buttons unambiguous. We should move the
> contents
> >> of the new highlights into the blog and flip the switch.
> >>
> >> So are we going to do it?
>
> --
> Austin Che           <austin at csail.mit.edu>          (617)253-5899
> _______________________________________________
> OpenWetWare Steering Committee Mailing List
> sc at openwetware.org
> http://mailman.mit.edu/mailman/listinfo/oww-sc
>
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From austin at csail.mit.edu  Tue Jan 22 10:20:56 2008
From: austin at csail.mit.edu (Austin Che)
Date: Tue, 22 Jan 2008 10:20:56 -0500
Subject: [OWW-SC] New icons for OWW Feedback and Lab Notebook
In-Reply-To: <6e9f40380801220701w27de9f16kfa7a0bbae47bddb8@mail.gmail.com>
	(Reshma Shetty's message of "Tue, 22 Jan 2008 10:01:06 -0500")
References: <26428aaa0801171316q126b4e4cs514b7cb0a7130970@mail.gmail.com>
	<6e9f40380801200925h27c88a5evd3ee304c36786d0a@mail.gmail.com>
	<87r6gcywmz.fsf@nitsua.mit.edu>
	<26428aaa0801210650k458faaf3i506b8aa0320a8de4@mail.gmail.com>
	<7c085c480801210721h1231fb89vf8af2b8555a250a0@mail.gmail.com>
	<26428aaa0801210811t61ec084alb2f0d47f804bd214@mail.gmail.com>
	<6e9f40380801210814k37f338dap2c6a3450abbf3012@mail.gmail.com>
	<87tzl7xi2i.fsf@nitsua.mit.edu>
	<6e9f40380801220701w27de9f16kfa7a0bbae47bddb8@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <87sl0prinb.fsf@nitsua.mit.edu>

    
    I ran this on the front page
    http://www.websiteoptimization.com/services/analyze/index.html
    The list of page objects is useful. 
    
    It said the download time given a T1 connection is 8.17 seconds. I
    didn't believe it but I cleared my browser cache and loaded the
    front page and it was really close to 8 seconds. This is awfully
    slow.
    
    The largest element object was
    http://openwetware.org/extensions/ExhibitExtension/scripts/austin-wiki-toolbox-bundle.js

    I made a small change so that should no longer be added to pages
    not using exhibit. However, the page is still measuring at 7.5
    seconds on a T1 line. I think the main problem is that the front
    page still has over 80K of images.

-- 
Austin Che           <austin at csail.mit.edu>          (617)253-5899


From jasonk at MIT.EDU  Tue Jan 22 10:31:17 2008
From: jasonk at MIT.EDU (Jason Kelly)
Date: Tue, 22 Jan 2008 10:31:17 -0500
Subject: [OWW-SC] New icons for OWW Feedback and Lab Notebook
In-Reply-To: <6e9f40380801220701w27de9f16kfa7a0bbae47bddb8@mail.gmail.com>
References: <26428aaa0801171316q126b4e4cs514b7cb0a7130970@mail.gmail.com>
	<6e9f40380801200925h27c88a5evd3ee304c36786d0a@mail.gmail.com>
	<87r6gcywmz.fsf@nitsua.mit.edu>
	<26428aaa0801210650k458faaf3i506b8aa0320a8de4@mail.gmail.com>
	<7c085c480801210721h1231fb89vf8af2b8555a250a0@mail.gmail.com>
	<26428aaa0801210811t61ec084alb2f0d47f804bd214@mail.gmail.com>
	<6e9f40380801210814k37f338dap2c6a3450abbf3012@mail.gmail.com>
	<87tzl7xi2i.fsf@nitsua.mit.edu>
	<6e9f40380801220701w27de9f16kfa7a0bbae47bddb8@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <7c085c480801220731l3d189203p95ab69aae62e3806@mail.gmail.com>

I took a look at the google analytics on the main page (attached).
There were a fair number of clicks on the protocols link, but
unfortunately it doesn't distinguish between those that were on the
tool bar and those that were on the main page.

I'm kind of against removing the protocols button on the main page,
personally.  someone new to the site (e.g. the people I think the main
page is targeted to)  might not notice the small links on the left
hand side.  same goes for help and about us, which I think should be
featured prominently.  resources could probably go.

thanks,
jason

On Jan 22, 2008 10:01 AM, Reshma Shetty <rshetty at mit.edu> wrote:
> I went ahead and implemented these changes.  I'm not 100% sure it is a good
> idea because Protocols are pretty heavily used on the site so having a
> prominent button can be useful.  This button bar isn't just on the main page
> but also shows up on several other pages.  But we'll give it a shot.
>
> Let me know what folks think.  We can always roll back the change.
>
> -Reshma
>
>
>
> On Jan 21, 2008 11:24 AM, Austin Che <austin at csail.mit.edu > wrote:
> >
> >    While we're on redundancy, the About Us link is present three
> >    times, and the Help and Protocols links are present twice on the
> >    main page. It seems the Resources button should go into the
> >    sidebar with the other resources. It's unclear why Protocols is a
> >    button but Materials isn't. I think it would be easy to make that
> >    bar into a single line of buttons and remove the duplicates and
> >    move some into the sidebar. Perhaps a bar with just Labs, Courses,
> >    Groups, and Blogs.
> >
> >
> > > I was thinking the same thing.  Everything on it is either a button, in
> the
> > > blog already or has been a news highlight for a while.  Plus, this at
> least
> > > slightly decreases the size of the main page.
> > >
> > > So I just went ahead and removed the news highlights.  New highlights
> can be
> > > posted to the blog in the future.
> > >
> > > -Reshma
> > >
> > > On Jan 21, 2008 11:11 AM, Bill F <bill.altmail at gmail.com> wrote:
> > >
> > >> Good idea. That gets rid of the redundant use of 'news' on the front
> page
> > >> as well. It makes the top buttons unambiguous. We should move the
> contents
> > >> of the new highlights into the blog and flip the switch.
> > >>
> > >> So are we going to do it?
> >
> > --
> >
> >
> >
> > Austin Che           <austin at csail.mit.edu>          (617)253-5899
> > _______________________________________________
> > OpenWetWare Steering Committee Mailing List
> > sc at openwetware.org
> > http://mailman.mit.edu/mailman/listinfo/oww-sc
> >
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> OpenWetWare Steering Committee Mailing List
> sc at openwetware.org
> http://mailman.mit.edu/mailman/listinfo/oww-sc
>
>
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From bcanton at MIT.EDU  Tue Jan 22 10:36:24 2008
From: bcanton at MIT.EDU (Barry Canton)
Date: Tue, 22 Jan 2008 10:36:24 -0500
Subject: [OWW-SC] New icons for OWW Feedback and Lab Notebook
In-Reply-To: <7c085c480801220731l3d189203p95ab69aae62e3806@mail.gmail.com>
References: <26428aaa0801171316q126b4e4cs514b7cb0a7130970@mail.gmail.com>
	<6e9f40380801200925h27c88a5evd3ee304c36786d0a@mail.gmail.com>
	<87r6gcywmz.fsf@nitsua.mit.edu>
	<26428aaa0801210650k458faaf3i506b8aa0320a8de4@mail.gmail.com>
	<7c085c480801210721h1231fb89vf8af2b8555a250a0@mail.gmail.com>
	<26428aaa0801210811t61ec084alb2f0d47f804bd214@mail.gmail.com>
	<6e9f40380801210814k37f338dap2c6a3450abbf3012@mail.gmail.com>
	<87tzl7xi2i.fsf@nitsua.mit.edu>
	<6e9f40380801220701w27de9f16kfa7a0bbae47bddb8@mail.gmail.com>
	<7c085c480801220731l3d189203p95ab69aae62e3806@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <52c0d2160801220736g64363878t19ba3cfc5b2b199e@mail.gmail.com>

One option would be to fold Labs and Groups into one button and then put
Protocols back into the fourth button spot.  That would help maintain a
balance between content and "social networking" type features.
Barry

On Jan 22, 2008 10:31 AM, Jason Kelly <jasonk at mit.edu> wrote:

> I took a look at the google analytics on the main page (attached).
> There were a fair number of clicks on the protocols link, but
> unfortunately it doesn't distinguish between those that were on the
> tool bar and those that were on the main page.
>
> I'm kind of against removing the protocols button on the main page,
> personally.  someone new to the site (e.g. the people I think the main
> page is targeted to)  might not notice the small links on the left
> hand side.  same goes for help and about us, which I think should be
> featured prominently.  resources could probably go.
>
> thanks,
> jason
>
> On Jan 22, 2008 10:01 AM, Reshma Shetty <rshetty at mit.edu> wrote:
> > I went ahead and implemented these changes.  I'm not 100% sure it is a
> good
> > idea because Protocols are pretty heavily used on the site so having a
> > prominent button can be useful.  This button bar isn't just on the main
> page
> > but also shows up on several other pages.  But we'll give it a shot.
> >
> > Let me know what folks think.  We can always roll back the change.
> >
> > -Reshma
> >
> >
> >
> > On Jan 21, 2008 11:24 AM, Austin Che <austin at csail.mit.edu > wrote:
> > >
> > >    While we're on redundancy, the About Us link is present three
> > >    times, and the Help and Protocols links are present twice on the
> > >    main page. It seems the Resources button should go into the
> > >    sidebar with the other resources. It's unclear why Protocols is a
> > >    button but Materials isn't. I think it would be easy to make that
> > >    bar into a single line of buttons and remove the duplicates and
> > >    move some into the sidebar. Perhaps a bar with just Labs, Courses,
> > >    Groups, and Blogs.
> > >
> > >
> > > > I was thinking the same thing.  Everything on it is either a button,
> in
> > the
> > > > blog already or has been a news highlight for a while.  Plus, this
> at
> > least
> > > > slightly decreases the size of the main page.
> > > >
> > > > So I just went ahead and removed the news highlights.  New
> highlights
> > can be
> > > > posted to the blog in the future.
> > > >
> > > > -Reshma
> > > >
> > > > On Jan 21, 2008 11:11 AM, Bill F <bill.altmail at gmail.com> wrote:
> > > >
> > > >> Good idea. That gets rid of the redundant use of 'news' on the
> front
> > page
> > > >> as well. It makes the top buttons unambiguous. We should move the
> > contents
> > > >> of the new highlights into the blog and flip the switch.
> > > >>
> > > >> So are we going to do it?
> > >
> > > --
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > Austin Che           <austin at csail.mit.edu>          (617)253-5899
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > OpenWetWare Steering Committee Mailing List
> > > sc at openwetware.org
> > > http://mailman.mit.edu/mailman/listinfo/oww-sc
> > >
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > OpenWetWare Steering Committee Mailing List
> > sc at openwetware.org
> > http://mailman.mit.edu/mailman/listinfo/oww-sc
> >
> >
>
> _______________________________________________
> OpenWetWare Steering Committee Mailing List
> sc at openwetware.org
> http://mailman.mit.edu/mailman/listinfo/oww-sc
>
>


-- 
Barry Canton
Endy Lab
Biological Engineering Division
Massachusetts Institute of Technology

Tel.:(617) 401-7320 (Grand Central)
Email1: bcanton at mit.edu
Email2: bcanton at gmail.com
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From austin at csail.mit.edu  Tue Jan 22 10:41:15 2008
From: austin at csail.mit.edu (Austin Che)
Date: Tue, 22 Jan 2008 10:41:15 -0500
Subject: [OWW-SC] New icons for OWW Feedback and Lab Notebook
In-Reply-To: <7c085c480801220731l3d189203p95ab69aae62e3806@mail.gmail.com>
	(Jason Kelly's message of "Tue, 22 Jan 2008 10:31:17 -0500")
References: <26428aaa0801171316q126b4e4cs514b7cb0a7130970@mail.gmail.com>
	<6e9f40380801200925h27c88a5evd3ee304c36786d0a@mail.gmail.com>
	<87r6gcywmz.fsf@nitsua.mit.edu>
	<26428aaa0801210650k458faaf3i506b8aa0320a8de4@mail.gmail.com>
	<7c085c480801210721h1231fb89vf8af2b8555a250a0@mail.gmail.com>
	<26428aaa0801210811t61ec084alb2f0d47f804bd214@mail.gmail.com>
	<6e9f40380801210814k37f338dap2c6a3450abbf3012@mail.gmail.com>
	<87tzl7xi2i.fsf@nitsua.mit.edu>
	<6e9f40380801220701w27de9f16kfa7a0bbae47bddb8@mail.gmail.com>
	<7c085c480801220731l3d189203p95ab69aae62e3806@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <87k5m1rhpg.fsf@nitsua.mit.edu>


> I took a look at the google analytics on the main page (attached).
> There were a fair number of clicks on the protocols link, but
> unfortunately it doesn't distinguish between those that were on the
> tool bar and those that were on the main page.

    The most common click from the Main Page is to itself? Does that
    mean we're confusing people to clicking in circles?
    
> I'm kind of against removing the protocols button on the main page,
> personally.  someone new to the site (e.g. the people I think the main
> page is targeted to)  might not notice the small links on the left
> hand side.  same goes for help and about us, which I think should be
> featured prominently.  resources could probably go.

    I thought the majority of new users come in not through the front
    page but via google. If we want to feature protocols prominently,
    we should make the link in the sidebar stand out more.
    
    I agree the current about us link in the blue box could be made to
    stand out more prominently.
    
    I don't think help matters. The help isn't for non-oww users and
    oww users should be able to find it.
    
-- 
Austin Che           <austin at csail.mit.edu>          (617)253-5899


From macowell at gmail.com  Tue Jan 22 17:05:28 2008
From: macowell at gmail.com (Mackenzie Cowell)
Date: Tue, 22 Jan 2008 17:05:28 -0500
Subject: [OWW-SC] John Udell: Bloggers talk to bloggers,
	scientists talk to scientists
Message-ID: <54746a3f0801221405w27fc2a3bs5b79a2fa67ceb107@mail.gmail.com>

Jason Morrison pointed me to an interesting blog post by technologist John
Udell called Bloggers talk to bloggers, scientists talk to
scientists<http://blog.jonudell.net/2008/01/22/bloggers-talk-to-bloggers-scientists-talk-to-scientists/>
.

It's an interesting and short post about his perception of the lack of
interconnects between the long-term "academic" discussions that are
conducted basically by publishing primary literature articles and the
discussions about and relating to the science published via blogs and more
domestic sources like mainstream news websites.  Quote:

"The mainstream vector was a New York Times magazine story on obesity. It
got to the blogosophere by way of a Wired News story. But the original
Nature Biotechnology article mentioned in the Wired story was linked nowhere
that I could find."


Check it out.  It's insightful and asks some good questions.  Also, did we
send anyone to the recent Science Blogging conference in North Carolina this
weekend?
Mac

-- 
Mac Cowell
iGEM Coordinator
igem.org
231.313.9062
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From tk at csail.mit.edu  Thu Jan 24 20:49:30 2008
From: tk at csail.mit.edu (Tom Knight)
Date: Thu, 24 Jan 2008 20:49:30 -0500
Subject: [OWW-SC] Fwd: [csail-related] seeking wikipedia editor
Message-ID: <f6c0fc32f5779ef3d661eacf30d7f55d@csail.mit.edu>

Perhaps we should volunteer as guinea pigs.


Begin forwarded message:

> From: David Karger <karger at mit.edu>
> Date: January 24, 2008 5:28:13 PM EST
> To: csail-related at csail.mit.edu
> Cc: David Huynh <dfhuynh at csail.mit.edu>
> Subject: [csail-related] seeking wikipedia editor
>
> We've been developing some web UI tools that we think would be useful
> inside Wikipedia, and are seeking someone high in the (supposedly
> nonexistent) wikipedia hierarchy to talk to about them, see if they
> agree with us, and understand how we get them 'accepted' into the
> wikipedia codebase.  If you know anyone it would be good to talk to,
> please pass on the info to me.
> Thanks
> David Karger
>
> _______________________________________________
> Csail-related mailing list
> Csail-related at lists.csail.mit.edu
> https://lists.csail.mit.edu/mailman/listinfo/csail-related
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From austin at csail.mit.edu  Thu Jan 24 22:09:20 2008
From: austin at csail.mit.edu (Austin Che)
Date: Thu, 24 Jan 2008 22:09:20 -0500
Subject: [OWW-SC] Fwd: [csail-related] seeking wikipedia editor
In-Reply-To: <f6c0fc32f5779ef3d661eacf30d7f55d@csail.mit.edu> (Tom Knight's
	message of "Thu, 24 Jan 2008 20:49:30 -0500")
References: <f6c0fc32f5779ef3d661eacf30d7f55d@csail.mit.edu>
Message-ID: <87myqubnz3.fsf@nitsua.mit.edu>


    We already are. We're already using their tools like Exhibit and
    Wibbit. Timeline might also be good to use.
    
> Perhaps we should volunteer as guinea pigs.
> Begin forwarded message:
>
> From: David Karger <karger at mit.edu>
> Date: January 24, 2008 5:28:13 PM EST
> To: csail-related at csail.mit.edu
> Cc: David Huynh <dfhuynh at csail.mit.edu>
> Subject: [csail-related] seeking wikipedia editor
>
> We've been developing some web UI tools that we think would be useful
> inside Wikipedia, and are seeking someone high in the (supposedly
> nonexistent) wikipedia hierarchy to talk to about them, see if they
> agree with us, and understand how we get them 'accepted' into the
> wikipedia codebase.  If you know anyone it would be good to talk to,
> please pass on the info to me.
> Thanks
> David Karger
>
> _______________________________________________
> Csail-related mailing list
> Csail-related at lists.csail.mit.edu
> https://lists.csail.mit.edu/mailman/listinfo/csail-related
> _______________________________________________
> OpenWetWare Steering Committee Mailing List
> sc at openwetware.org
> http://mailman.mit.edu/mailman/listinfo/oww-sc

-- 
Austin Che           <austin at csail.mit.edu>          (617)253-5899


From macowell at gmail.com  Mon Jan 28 18:09:29 2008
From: macowell at gmail.com (Mackenzie Cowell)
Date: Mon, 28 Jan 2008 18:09:29 -0500
Subject: [OWW-SC] Fwd: Science BarCamp/SHDH
In-Reply-To: <8ba0586d0801281442i3d4e297fs1e4b20c18f899691@mail.gmail.com>
References: <8ba0586d0801281442i3d4e297fs1e4b20c18f899691@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <54746a3f0801281509y417b2cf5u1734c4a8f2e50d6d@mail.gmail.com>

Jason Morrison found an interesting article called Silicon Valley Hackfest
Hints at How Laboratory Scientists Could
Communicate<http://scienceblogs.com/retrospectacle/2007/10/superhappydevcon_20_hints_at_h.php>.
Here's the money quote:

"Coders are accustomed to communicating with each other must faster than
their laboratory-bound counterparts. Some Google employees told me how they
are barraged each day with a phalanx of email. Countless message boards, IRC
channels, and other sites allow isolated programmers to share with each
other. And then we have this: a gathering with lightning talks and guys
squeezed ten to a folding table sharing ideas as quickly as they can speak.
Perhaps this allows their culture and projects to evolve more quickly as
well.

By comparison, there are few chemistry message boards, and only the open
access journals like chemistry central include a comments thread alongside
every peer-reviewed research paper, and conferences are dry, twice-a-year
poster and powerpoint affairs.

It makes perfect sense that information technology for laboratory scientists
would lag behind that which is at the disposal of career programmers,
because the coders can make their own. But despite that understanding, I
want more. I want lightning talks, and hack days, and zillions of active
boards for biologists and chemists and physicists."

Interestingly, Jason points out that he originally found the article because
it was linked two in a different post by Bryan Bishop, who has posted to the
BBF-standards workshop.

I'm not sure how a biology-based 12-hour hackfest / devhouse would work, but
we should figure it out and hold one (we could at least have a parts
curation party for the registry...).

Mac

---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: Jason Morrison <jason.p.morrison at gmail.com>
Date: Jan 28, 2008 5:42 PM
Subject: Science BarCamp/SHDH
To: Mackenzie Cowell <macowell at gmail.com>


http://www.barcamp.org/Barcamp%20and%20Hackfest

(links to
http://scienceblogs.com/retrospectacle/2007/10/superhappydevcon_20_hints_at_h.php
)

Of interest: I think the barcamp article is posted by Bryan Bishop
(http://heybryan.org/) from Austin TX and has posted to the
BBF-standards mailing list.

Jason

--
Jason Morrison
jason.p.morrison at gmail.com
http://jayunit.net
(585) 216-5657



-- 
Mac Cowell
iGEM Coordinator
igem.org
231.313.9062
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From julius at younglucks.com  Mon Jan 28 18:26:18 2008
From: julius at younglucks.com (julius@younglucks.com)
Date: Mon, 28 Jan 2008 23:26:18 +0000
Subject: [OWW-SC] Fwd: Science BarCamp/SHDH
In-Reply-To: <54746a3f0801281509y417b2cf5u1734c4a8f2e50d6d@mail.gmail.com>
References: <8ba0586d0801281442i3d4e297fs1e4b20c18f899691@mail.gmail.com>
	<54746a3f0801281509y417b2cf5u1734c4a8f2e50d6d@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <20080128232618.unpm7p2gnz8k4s4s@webmail.younglucks.com>

It could be a nice part of an OWW conference.  What ever happened to  
discussions about a conference?

Sounds like a good SC blog topic.

Julius

Quoting Mackenzie Cowell <macowell at gmail.com>:

> Jason Morrison found an interesting article called Silicon Valley Hackfest
> Hints at How Laboratory Scientists Could
> Communicate<http://scienceblogs.com/retrospectacle/2007/10/superhappydevcon_20_hints_at_h.php>.
> Here's the money quote:
>
> "Coders are accustomed to communicating with each other must faster than
> their laboratory-bound counterparts. Some Google employees told me how they
> are barraged each day with a phalanx of email. Countless message boards, IRC
> channels, and other sites allow isolated programmers to share with each
> other. And then we have this: a gathering with lightning talks and guys
> squeezed ten to a folding table sharing ideas as quickly as they can speak.
> Perhaps this allows their culture and projects to evolve more quickly as
> well.
>
> By comparison, there are few chemistry message boards, and only the open
> access journals like chemistry central include a comments thread alongside
> every peer-reviewed research paper, and conferences are dry, twice-a-year
> poster and powerpoint affairs.
>
> It makes perfect sense that information technology for laboratory scientists
> would lag behind that which is at the disposal of career programmers,
> because the coders can make their own. But despite that understanding, I
> want more. I want lightning talks, and hack days, and zillions of active
> boards for biologists and chemists and physicists."
>
> Interestingly, Jason points out that he originally found the article because
> it was linked two in a different post by Bryan Bishop, who has posted to the
> BBF-standards workshop.
>
> I'm not sure how a biology-based 12-hour hackfest / devhouse would work, but
> we should figure it out and hold one (we could at least have a parts
> curation party for the registry...).
>
> Mac
>
> ---------- Forwarded message ----------
> From: Jason Morrison <jason.p.morrison at gmail.com>
> Date: Jan 28, 2008 5:42 PM
> Subject: Science BarCamp/SHDH
> To: Mackenzie Cowell <macowell at gmail.com>
>
>
> http://www.barcamp.org/Barcamp%20and%20Hackfest
>
> (links to
> http://scienceblogs.com/retrospectacle/2007/10/superhappydevcon_20_hints_at_h.php
> )
>
> Of interest: I think the barcamp article is posted by Bryan Bishop
> (http://heybryan.org/) from Austin TX and has posted to the
> BBF-standards mailing list.
>
> Jason
>
> --
> Jason Morrison
> jason.p.morrison at gmail.com
> http://jayunit.net
> (585) 216-5657
>
>
>
> --
> Mac Cowell
> iGEM Coordinator
> igem.org
> 231.313.9062
>







From julius at younglucks.com  Mon Jan 28 18:26:38 2008
From: julius at younglucks.com (julius@younglucks.com)
Date: Mon, 28 Jan 2008 23:26:38 +0000
Subject: [OWW-SC] Fwd: Science BarCamp/SHDH
In-Reply-To: <54746a3f0801281509y417b2cf5u1734c4a8f2e50d6d@mail.gmail.com>
References: <8ba0586d0801281442i3d4e297fs1e4b20c18f899691@mail.gmail.com>
	<54746a3f0801281509y417b2cf5u1734c4a8f2e50d6d@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <20080128232638.ockh1l8mm6840ccs@webmail.younglucks.com>

It could be a nice part of an OWW conference.  What ever happened to  
discussions about a conference?

Sounds like a good SC blog topic.

Julius

Quoting Mackenzie Cowell <macowell at gmail.com>:

> Jason Morrison found an interesting article called Silicon Valley Hackfest
> Hints at How Laboratory Scientists Could
> Communicate<http://scienceblogs.com/retrospectacle/2007/10/superhappydevcon_20_hints_at_h.php>.
> Here's the money quote:
>
> "Coders are accustomed to communicating with each other must faster than
> their laboratory-bound counterparts. Some Google employees told me how they
> are barraged each day with a phalanx of email. Countless message boards, IRC
> channels, and other sites allow isolated programmers to share with each
> other. And then we have this: a gathering with lightning talks and guys
> squeezed ten to a folding table sharing ideas as quickly as they can speak.
> Perhaps this allows their culture and projects to evolve more quickly as
> well.
>
> By comparison, there are few chemistry message boards, and only the open
> access journals like chemistry central include a comments thread alongside
> every peer-reviewed research paper, and conferences are dry, twice-a-year
> poster and powerpoint affairs.
>
> It makes perfect sense that information technology for laboratory scientists
> would lag behind that which is at the disposal of career programmers,
> because the coders can make their own. But despite that understanding, I
> want more. I want lightning talks, and hack days, and zillions of active
> boards for biologists and chemists and physicists."
>
> Interestingly, Jason points out that he originally found the article because
> it was linked two in a different post by Bryan Bishop, who has posted to the
> BBF-standards workshop.
>
> I'm not sure how a biology-based 12-hour hackfest / devhouse would work, but
> we should figure it out and hold one (we could at least have a parts
> curation party for the registry...).
>
> Mac
>
> ---------- Forwarded message ----------
> From: Jason Morrison <jason.p.morrison at gmail.com>
> Date: Jan 28, 2008 5:42 PM
> Subject: Science BarCamp/SHDH
> To: Mackenzie Cowell <macowell at gmail.com>
>
>
> http://www.barcamp.org/Barcamp%20and%20Hackfest
>
> (links to
> http://scienceblogs.com/retrospectacle/2007/10/superhappydevcon_20_hints_at_h.php
> )
>
> Of interest: I think the barcamp article is posted by Bryan Bishop
> (http://heybryan.org/) from Austin TX and has posted to the
> BBF-standards mailing list.
>
> Jason
>
> --
> Jason Morrison
> jason.p.morrison at gmail.com
> http://jayunit.net
> (585) 216-5657
>
>
>
> --
> Mac Cowell
> iGEM Coordinator
> igem.org
> 231.313.9062
>







From julius at younglucks.com  Mon Jan 28 18:26:46 2008
From: julius at younglucks.com (julius@younglucks.com)
Date: Mon, 28 Jan 2008 23:26:46 +0000
Subject: [OWW-SC] Fwd: Science BarCamp/SHDH
In-Reply-To: <54746a3f0801281509y417b2cf5u1734c4a8f2e50d6d@mail.gmail.com>
References: <8ba0586d0801281442i3d4e297fs1e4b20c18f899691@mail.gmail.com>
	<54746a3f0801281509y417b2cf5u1734c4a8f2e50d6d@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <20080128232646.khvl2h6dioaosw0k@webmail.younglucks.com>

It could be a nice part of an OWW conference.  What ever happened to  
discussions about a conference?

Sounds like a good SC blog topic.

Julius

Quoting Mackenzie Cowell <macowell at gmail.com>:

> Jason Morrison found an interesting article called Silicon Valley Hackfest
> Hints at How Laboratory Scientists Could
> Communicate<http://scienceblogs.com/retrospectacle/2007/10/superhappydevcon_20_hints_at_h.php>.
> Here's the money quote:
>
> "Coders are accustomed to communicating with each other must faster than
> their laboratory-bound counterparts. Some Google employees told me how they
> are barraged each day with a phalanx of email. Countless message boards, IRC
> channels, and other sites allow isolated programmers to share with each
> other. And then we have this: a gathering with lightning talks and guys
> squeezed ten to a folding table sharing ideas as quickly as they can speak.
> Perhaps this allows their culture and projects to evolve more quickly as
> well.
>
> By comparison, there are few chemistry message boards, and only the open
> access journals like chemistry central include a comments thread alongside
> every peer-reviewed research paper, and conferences are dry, twice-a-year
> poster and powerpoint affairs.
>
> It makes perfect sense that information technology for laboratory scientists
> would lag behind that which is at the disposal of career programmers,
> because the coders can make their own. But despite that understanding, I
> want more. I want lightning talks, and hack days, and zillions of active
> boards for biologists and chemists and physicists."
>
> Interestingly, Jason points out that he originally found the article because
> it was linked two in a different post by Bryan Bishop, who has posted to the
> BBF-standards workshop.
>
> I'm not sure how a biology-based 12-hour hackfest / devhouse would work, but
> we should figure it out and hold one (we could at least have a parts
> curation party for the registry...).
>
> Mac
>
> ---------- Forwarded message ----------
> From: Jason Morrison <jason.p.morrison at gmail.com>
> Date: Jan 28, 2008 5:42 PM
> Subject: Science BarCamp/SHDH
> To: Mackenzie Cowell <macowell at gmail.com>
>
>
> http://www.barcamp.org/Barcamp%20and%20Hackfest
>
> (links to
> http://scienceblogs.com/retrospectacle/2007/10/superhappydevcon_20_hints_at_h.php
> )
>
> Of interest: I think the barcamp article is posted by Bryan Bishop
> (http://heybryan.org/) from Austin TX and has posted to the
> BBF-standards mailing list.
>
> Jason
>
> --
> Jason Morrison
> jason.p.morrison at gmail.com
> http://jayunit.net
> (585) 216-5657
>
>
>
> --
> Mac Cowell
> iGEM Coordinator
> igem.org
> 231.313.9062
>







From julius at younglucks.com  Mon Jan 28 21:36:45 2008
From: julius at younglucks.com (julius@younglucks.com)
Date: Tue, 29 Jan 2008 02:36:45 +0000
Subject: [OWW-SC] Feedback Spam
Message-ID: <20080129023645.i10thpdghs9c8g8k@webmail.younglucks.com>

How are we getting hit so hard with spam on the feedback list?  Is  
there something we can do?

Cheers,

Julius